Steps 3 Through 11 Built a Foundation the Pandemic Could Not Break – Diego R.

Welcome back my friends to AA Recovery Interviews. I'm your host, Howard L., and I'm an alcoholic.
Sober since January 1st, 1988, one day at a time. I'm grateful you've joined us. AA
Recovery Interviews is the podcast where Alcoholics Anonymous members from around the world share
their extraordinary stories of experience, strength, and hope. If you've enjoyed one,
or all of the more than 120 interviews in this podcast series, will you do a little
service work by spreading the word about this rich and meaningful listening experience?
This show is another helping hand of AA we can all extend to alcoholics everywhere. My
guest on today's AA Recovery Interviews is Diego R., who grew up in a fear-ridden household
with an alcoholic father whose rage left an indelible mark on the only child. Though his
father left when he was five, Diego had learned how to use rage and rebellion to compensate
for his fear and lack of self-confidence. By the time he started drinking, the alcohol
combusted with his attitude and egoism to stoke a fast and reckless lifestyle. Working
as a mechanical engineer, Diego's job had two-, three-, and four-week rotations that
allowed him to drink and chase women unimpeded while he was off the job. Working at facilities
around the world, he was a functional alcoholic, fulfilling many critical roles, but his around-the-clock
work commitment meant he couldn't drink for up to 28 days at a time. As the disease progressed,
he spent much of his time on the job devising elaborate plans for his inevitable benders
once off duty. Drinking soon occupied all his hours off the job and started to bleed
into Diego's ability to perform his work while on the job. Ironically, one of Diego's
roles involved monitoring other employees for alcohol and drug use, but working in an
environment where drinking and alcoholism were rife continued to make life more miserable
for him. Hitting bottom in 2018, Diego committed to AA's program of recovery and he has been
a sober, active, and engaged member of the program since. Staying sober for five-plus
years has generated many gifts for Diego and countless opportunities to be of service to
other sober alcoholics. I think you will find his testimony to be of great value, especially
those of you in the early years of your AA program. And though it may take a few seconds
to acclimate yourself to Diego's Venezuelan accent, your investment of one hour to listen
to Diego's awesome story will be time well spent. So please enjoy this episode of AA
Recovery Interviews con mi amigo y AA hermano, Diego R.
Diego, I'm an alcoholic.
Hi, Diego. That's the right answer to that one. I'm so glad that you were able to make
the time today to join me on AA Recovery Interviews podcast.
I appreciate your willingness of having me.
Oh yeah. I knew that I wanted to do that for a while now and you and I were in a meeting
together today and you just celebrated five years of sobriety.
What was your sobriety day?
April 12, 2018.
Yeah, so you picked up your five-year chip. I got the opportunity to see you get that.
What did that mean to you to get that five-year chip?
Well, it is a powerful reminder and a blessing. That brings me back to my relapse before that
time. It brings me back to where it all started. I very first went to an AA meeting back in
Columbia, South America after trying to go after all my attempts to make my life better.
What they told me I was supposed to do or be in order to be happy, but nothing worked.
It was not that big job, not that good-looking chick, not that amazing dream location. What
was happening was that I was feeling depressed and defeated in repeated occasions. So after
finding that option, I unfortunately stopped going to meetings and I ended up feeling the
same way because I just selected or just neglected about it. The bottom line was that I ended
up feeling the same way here in Houston where God wanted me to be, but I was kind of avoiding
because it was not fun enough for a single person like me. Of course, my ego was popping
up, but that relapse was a must for me and my sobriety because otherwise I'd probably
be still trying to make my way instead of God's way. So those five years putting together
that relapse, the pandemic, and the lapse which was longer than usual and expected without
having that little higher power I was maintaining called my job or my professional achievements
was something that much needed and solid foundation to remember how powerless I am.
That's the good thing about birthdays, isn't it, that you have the opportunity to kind
of revisit where you've been over the time, whether it's involved relapsing or staying
sober. It's such a great opportunity to kind of gauge where your life is at any given point.
So you grew up in Colombia. Venezuela. My family is from Colombia, but I'm born and
raised in Venezuela. I grew up kind of between, but yeah, home was Venezuela and I was very
well aware of Colombian culture too because I kind of gravitated between. What was your
childhood like in Venezuela? Well, he was a happy childhood, an alcoholic dad and trying
his best to raise a happy kid with all his flaws and attempts to be a better dad until
I was five. Back then we thought he was a consistent and never drunk drinker, but in
fact his behavior was dramatically affected by that first drink. After five he lived home,
so we just moved to another place which has a lot of greenery and a bunch of kids. So
had a pretty happy childhood, but of course it was borderline, economically speaking,
were you raised by your mom? By my mom. So of course for her, raising a kid on herself
in a country that was not hers. She's from Colombia. She's from Colombia. He was from
Venezuela. My parents after they got together, they went to Venezuela together from Colombia.
So they were both Colombian by birth. Exactly. So you were born in Venezuela? I was born
in Venezuela, Valencia and then brought to Maracaibo, which is Western Venezuela. So
do you have siblings, brothers and sisters? Not from mom and dad, but I have half sisters
and a half younger brother. When you were five years old, your dad left, was it a divorce
that had him leave or did he just... No, they just played and dad tried to submit a divorce
from the distance, but that didn't happen because it was a young kid and they didn't
have the sufficient time not being together to claim dad as a legal option. So you were
split without a formal divorce in place for a few years. And yeah, it was kind of decent
one, but a few challenges came along. Dad was a highly reactive person, so I got some
of that for sure. You mean his behavior towards you? Yes, in general. In general, he was,
he was, he was, he was righteous, sometimes a little violent, but he was, he was just,
you know, fear promoted reactions, I would say. So I was, I was really terrified of him
when I was little, whenever he was getting mad. Yeah, it was, he was a bit, a bit challenging.
Were you glad when he left? Not that sure because I was still missing him, but it was,
it was a relief for sure. The mom took over to the guidelines and rules at home in a probably
healthier way, but he was, he was dysfunctional all around transgenerational context anyway.
Lots of alcoholism in the family. Yes, a lot of alcoholism, abandonment, murder figures
due to violence, you know, a bunch of unfair events that took place. So just, just probably
a family or group of people trying to be the best they could with what they got. So there
you are, you're living in Venezuela, you're five years old, your dad splits, your mom's
now got the opportunity of raising you. Yes. By herself. Yes. What do the next few years
look like in your life? Well, that was, that was the home, our second home there, the one
I recall the most. Then we moved to, to a complex, which was pretty much a six building
complex, several apartments, a bunch of kids, a lot of space and greater play and basketball
and a basketball or multi-purpose court to play basketball and mini soccer. Not a lot
of, we were just kids trying to be kids back then. You're talking about the children in
the complex? Children, children in the complex, yeah, and in the school. So I was, I was getting
affected probably because I was a very shy, introverted kid with a clear image of an authoritarian
father not being that extroverted at all, probably opening a gate to kids just to take
a little advantage or be naughty. Nothing, nothing serious, nothing, nothing really bad.
But of course that affected me because it came up as a bullying. So were you bullied
as a, as a kid? Yeah, yes, I was in the school and where I was living. So there was, there
was a turning point probably after I was 10, 12 in which I tried to revert it or, or take
revenge from that because sometimes they were being kind of, mom was kind of pretty lady
steel so they, they were trying to be sometimes disrespectful. So I took that little role
of the man of the house which my dad leave me when I was five, by the way. He literally
told me, I'm leaving you, you be the man in the house. So you look after it, you too,
you look after your mom. So man of the house would be probably two and a half feet tall.
Exactly, that little man. So yeah, and then as soon as I had the chance, as I started
growing up and probably training and doing some, some martial arts, I of course took
my chance to, to look after that. And, and that unleashed that little gene or pattern
ingrained subconsciously by my father whenever he was feeling fearful. So it was, it was
a coping mechanism that I just adopted from him and people around. So the anger grew
not only out of the way you saw your dad respond to situations before he left, but because
of the circumstances of being bullied, your mom being disrespected, you being told that
you were the man of the house, you had a responsibility to protect her and also to protect yourself.
You did martial arts, what karate and that sort of thing. You worked out, you're, you
know, you definitely, you have the physique of a man who's worked out his whole life.
So how did that all play out?
10 to 12 when I started and then a lot of kind of mild abuses and unfair episodes that
I started to look after, probably take, get a grip on them. He went in an unexpected
way to, to a sort of uncontrolled rage or overreacting behavior when I was a teenager.
People around, whoever, whoever I was having the opportunity to out bring that reactiveness
I was just going after and to probably randomly drain that resentment and probably that powerlessness
as a kid whenever I got that little chance to do so. But it helped somehow then things
got more stable. I was kind of included or somehow gaining some respect around my peers,
my classmates at school and the guys that grew up with me where I lived back then. Things
started getting better, but I was still kind of really, really low self-esteem kind of
guy.
Angry all the time.
Angry quite often or highly reactive, happy sports oriented kid, but not really confident
when, when it came up to girls, especially in that environment. It was really tough for,
for all of us. It was just, then it became, it became a, you know, a kid's kind of rule.
So we were just building each other, but it was, it was more fun. It became something
it was part of the deal. You don't get angry because this is part of the game. So we're
just like building resistance and resilience against it. But that, that took me out of
the female interaction until I was 19 or, or 20.
When you were an adolescent, let's say an early teen to middle teenager, how were you
doing in school?
I was resistant in school. I was, I was not, not really focusing to it. I didn't want
to commit. I didn't want to engage. And I, I wanted to, to project a little rebellion
in that regard. That was until junior high. Then I started like to get a little better
thinking of my university chance in Venezuela. Education back then was free, but to get in
these public universities, which were very well renowned, it was really hard. So with
my high school grades, I was far from having a decent chance to get in. So I started working
my way after second year high school and it kind of got better towards the end and I somehow
made it.
Sounds like you turned the corner from being a rebel. You went into middle school. Somehow
you had some ambition knowing that university was not too far off. When did alcohol enter
the picture for you?
Well, my first experience, I was kind of denying it until not so long ago. And it was when
I was 16 or 15. I thought it was when I was 19 or 20, but in fact was, was there. And
it was, it was a final of a war cup in 94. So we were celebrating. We all had drinks
and I went, I went literally over. We went out to celebrate with some friends and it
was a rainy day. And of course the guy who was driving, I was in the back seat. He was,
she was drunk. I was also drunk, but I, I can barely just remember because I was really
affected by the alcohol. Even it was probably a small amount. I did not recall much of it.
So we got into an accident. We were just lucky because I recall I was not wearing seat belts
and then we just, we just crashed or hit the brakes on a slippery asphalt while raining
and hit a bus from behind. And I flew all the way from the back seat from co-pilot side
all the way to the pilot or driver's side, hit my head on my left eyebrow. And I just,
I just stayed unconscious for a few hours and they brought me to my mom and I was covered
in blood. They took me to the hospital. And that episode reminded me why my family members
and including my mom sometimes was kind of pointing my problem, my potential problem
with alcohol that I was of course denying because all those episodes in childhood and
being an adolescent or as a teenager kind of justified in my obsessive mind that kind
of trend and that I was somehow discerning it.
I get that. I think for a lot of people, especially when you've, when you've gone through what
you went through or gone through what I've went through, you feel almost an entitlement
to be able to, okay, I've, I've dealt with all this BS for years now. Now that I've found
alcohol and or drugs, I am deserving to have the release or whatever it is that I think
the drugs and alcohol are giving me. But it's really a false sense of confidence there,
isn't it?
Correct. Yes. It's a false sense of empowerment. I would say...
So you felt empowered when you drank.
I was. And then all those fears would tend to fade away. So that was the next stage and
it was when I started to try to dare to interact with some girls I liked, but I was so insecure
to do it on my own. So I needed alcohol to get me to that level. The first attempt, I
just, I just blacked out before them and I just lost it. And then I tried, I felt ashamed
because they, they got me drunk. There were girls, pretty pretty by the way, and I was
not able to keep up with them. So I have to train myself for that. And I did very well.
So you went into alcoholic training.
Alcoholic training and then also looking, looking to get into, into the old patch. I
cannot be this shameful kind of guy. I need to manage drinking in a decent way. And I,
and I did very well and it happened in normal time, I can tell.
So you, you found a way to train yourself to be a little bit more efficient and responsible
with the alcohol. So you're not blacking out the first time you meet somebody.
So this is when you said around 15, 16 years old, this is happening.
15, 16 and then that copy mechanism to be a decent social corporate alcoholic started
around the age of 19 or 20. Also, it came up after disappointed with my teenage sweetheart
that was a neighbor that she, of course, could probably board because I was so insecure to
just let her know what I was feeling or what I wanted to do. And then she, she gave me
the chance, but I was not doing much, stalking my fear and my, myself out. So I, I felt that
as a betrayal. And I went after chasing as many girls as I could.
As a reaction to that one relation.
As a reaction and kind of revenge, exactly. And on top of that, I put a lot of alcohol
to do that, to, to do it in the best possible way.
Now the people you were hanging with, did you have a, a group of people that you hung
out with or a gang or, or were you mostly on your own?
The majority of the kids, I was always in school. I was the youngest. My mom tried to
keep me probably kind of underaged. On all my grades, I was in first grade elementary
school. I was five years old when you're supposed to be seven. So along the way, I was always
the youngest. So I was while I was living in that residence and all my neighbors, they
were kind of older, they were experiencing different things. I was still not feeling
ready, not feeling sufficient to do that. So I got together with the guys that were
like kind of the underdogs, the non-accepted ones, the little rebels. And two of them,
they were, they were pretty heavy drinkers. And probably my closest one, he was smoking,
one of them, he was smoking cigarettes. And then he got into, into dope pretty early.
I was trying to cover him up because that was a taboo back in my hometown in Venezuela.
Everybody was smoking, but nobody was telling him was smoking. So I tried to cover him up
and that's how I came to know about marijuana. And then he started doing all the things,
but I was, I was heavily drinking with him. Were you doing the marijuana as well?
No, I was not brave enough to do so. I think somehow I just got scared to do that. But
I grew up around it. I was very, very close, marijuana and other sort of drugs, but probably
that little sense of responsibility of looking after home, my mom, and that, that wish to
help or be a better version to support my, my household as a key, it did not allow me
or gave me the permission to do that. I was just afraid to do it and I don't know, probably
was kind of God's plan.
So these guys, the two guys that you talked about hanging out with, both were heavier
drinkers than you and the one guy was, was much more into smoking marijuana and you didn't
want to do that. For how many years did you hang with these guys before, before you kind
of moved on?
Five to seven years, not exactly before, during and a little after university.
Yeah.
So you went to university for how many years?
Five.
Five years.
Five years of university and then, then I found some other friends there that were heavy
and solid drinkers there too. And that was another, another chapter, but somehow it got
all mixed together. The friends from childhood, the friends from, from high school, the friends
from university. And another thing is that I was hanging out with the baddest guys in
high school. And I mean bad guys.
They were somehow protecting me. And those were my, my friends in high school too.
Kind of like a gang?
Yeah, kind of. There were, there were especially three of them that they were like serious
in my hometown and coming from a school that I was being bullied by kind of spoiled kids.
Those guys, they were, they were serious and somehow they just took me under their wings
and protected me while being tough in a, in a really harsh environment.
They taught you how to be tough and harsh?
Sometimes they were giving me the chance when it was easy, when it was hard, they were,
they were stepping in and just keeping me behind.
That's kind of a mixed blessing, isn't it?
It was. It was. I think it was, it was, it was God's plan. And somehow we were shedding
a lot. Some of them went, went, went the bad way. Today it came to my mind that one of
them, he was, he went into, into bad businesses all over nationally and internationally too.
And he was a guy I was sharing sometimes breaks in high school. So he was, he was somehow
a blessing, but of course he was not part of my life for so long. And I just, and continued
university and I found a decent group of guys that guided me in a way better fashion just
to achieve my, my goal, which was finish my, my career, which was mechanical engineering,
as suggested by my dad in between those visits as, as I grew up and I was afraid and terrified
of that before. But then as I, as I went through it, I noticed that I was able to make it.
And then it, it became my career and it gave me a, probably one of the biggest, biggest
blessings of my life.
So you studied to become a mechanical engineer.
So you got your degree in mechanical engineering back in 2002.
So what did you feel with regard to the drinking about the time that you were getting your
degree? Did you, did you see a sense of freedom coming or had you laid off drinking during
your school?
Well, not that much. I had, actually it was, it was an interesting mix because my first
job came up from a reference from a university teacher. I had a professor, so that was the
link to very first contact, the company that hired me the first time. But then that was
like a startup or stepping stone. Then to get the job, I was more or less pursuing with
another that he was trying to follow another friend. He came up and he was closed and wrapped
up in a bar. That was a very famous old business workers bar in Western Venezuela. So it was
covered in food with expats back then. And I recall the manager of the company I wanted
to join was a guy from Louisiana and he was a full blown drinker. And the way I made that
click he needed, because they were choosing between four guys, two of us, we were friends
and we were like kind of young and had the willingness and eagerness to get better. And
we were doubling or tripling our experience and then technical background. But we made
a clique with this manager, drinking at a bar. And I went the extra mile asking a girl
for the dancing and I danced and you know, behaved as a player in front of him. He was
a player. And that was it. That was the day before the interview. And then on the interview,
he just knocked or high-fived me on the way in. And of course, that gave us a little advantage
over others and we got that job. And of course, the drinking routine became a habit and we
were all pretty much blacking out or passing out every Thursday at the same bar.
So your manager becomes your drinking pal, part of the same group?
Yes, exactly. Manager and superintendent, both.
Working on Thursday through the weekend, pretty much?
Well, they were only on a Thursday, probably Friday, but we working on a rotational basis,
seven by seven, seven days on, seven days off. That was over beginning to go all the
way until Sunday or probably then that was the first stage, Thursday to Sunday, nonstop.
And then as I start getting longer rotations, 14-14, 21-21, and so on and so forth, it was
probably a month on at work or on duty and a month off drinking literally every single
day. Well, it's curious what you were saying about,
you know, you got hired by a man who may have already been an alcoholic, but to get the
job, you kind of emulated him and then once hired, you continued on with your drinking
and the behavior. How many people were on the team with you under this supervisor?
Probably 10. And were you all in the same boat?
All of them, they were full-blown alcoholics from mentors, from peers, colleagues, supervisors,
managers all over, mostly expats from, yeah, from different places and Venezuelans. So
that mix between the weather or the kind of tropical twist, it was just a time bomb because
you can endlessly go in a perfect place in which people can make way more than with what
they earn surrounded by beautiful, gorgeous girls and pretty anarchic environment. You
can do whatever you want. You can drive, drink and drive. You can just go till the next day.
You can jump on a plane. You can go from one bar to the next or jump from one girl to the
next pretty easily. Sounds like a bachelor of alcoholics dream job.
Somehow, luckily, I was not getting paid that much, so I couldn't go that far.
Yeah, yeah. Now, are we still talking about in Venezuela? Is all this still happening
there? For how long did that continue?
That continued for about five and a half years before I made my first international move
to Mexico. But in between or before that, I had a couple of chances to go to Argentina
for training purposes, and then they gave me the chance, not being ready to do that,
but somehow they gave me the chance. It was a part of an international assignment, but
I was still a fresh trainee, but somehow they helped me and I made it, and they were decently
happy with my little support. It was not much, but at least a decent one.
Were those people the same kind of people that you were involved with, that they were
drinking or did you have to clean up or stop drinking for a period of time to get into
those opportunities?
They were all alcoholics. They were all alcoholics, and Argentina was not as bad, but in Venezuela,
all over the place, they were full-blown alcoholics. It was part of the game. Being in what I was
doing, upstream, drilling, oil business, it was pretty much the rule. You had to do it,
and it was a way to fit in, at least for me and for many of them, so I was trying to
please people. I was trying to show them something better than my actual version, somehow still
doubtful about my competencies and my self-worth, but definitely it was something pretty normal
to them. I was just lucky that it did not affect me.
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Did you ever get to the point where you looked at what you were having to do to progress
in your career and you looked at what you were doing to do it? I mean, drinking and
being around people who were always drinking and drunk. Did you ever get the sense that
maybe that wasn't the right way to go about life or did that just become so normal that
you didn't think about it?
Not at all. Never, never, ever thought about it. I was still, now that you mention it and
and thanks for that. It was just a little portion of rebellion still. You know, I didn't
want, I didn't want, still a rebel. I didn't want, I didn't want to just study no more.
I didn't want to do anything better. Probably a few trainings or whatever, but what I was
doing was good enough somehow by gaining experience to be a better version of myself, but not
doing functional trainings or functional improvements in my career. It was just going my alcoholic
way, not even thinking to see it as a potential portion that might affect my career negatively.
It might just get me into something really bad. Another thing was in Venezuela, drinking
and driving was not a big deal. So of course, DUIs were not even in the picture.
Really?
Sometimes I probably have several of them, but it was just not an option there. So you
were just drinking and driving all over the place. Small, small streets, small, not too
big town, not many highways, but still pretty, pretty dangerous and taking a lot of chances.
It was, it was just, thank God, doing for me what I could not do for myself.
Sounds like some higher power was looking out.
Really? Yeah, somehow, sometimes I was parking my car backwards as they taught me to do so
on that defensive train. But sometimes I was totally unsure or I had a blackout and I was
not sure if my car was dead or not.
How often were you blacking out? Were you blacking out every time you got drunk or occasionally?
Not that often. It was very, very occasionally. It was because I was feeling tired. So sometimes
I was just falling asleep and I was not remembering few episodes in very, very few occasions.
It was not that often. But some other people say, I don't remember nothing. I do remember.
But of course the mind was just fading away as the disease was progressing.
Was there drinking on the job that was going on?
Not at all. Not at all. It was, since it was a high-risk facility and a high-risk job,
we were pretty much not allowed to bring or have any alcohol despite it was a line operation.
So that was really serious because it was a high, it is a high-risk, highly critical
task. So that was not an option. And part of my duties was to check on people if they
were under the influence of alcohol and drugs.
So somehow that was an interlude from my alcoholism. But my mind was still thinking
of that. So during the job I was kind of responsible and probably afraid to lose it.
So therefore somehow respecting it. And probably was that little break that God was giving
me since He knew I would be drinking the rest of the time.
Yeah, I get that. So it sounds to me like you became what we all often call a functional
alcoholic where you could literally, when it came time to do certain things, you could
stop drinking for a period of time, get the work done, and then at the end of that do
whatever it was. The quantity that you were drinking while you weren't working in a critical
job situation. Did you have any effects while on the job from not drinking? I mean did you
ever, did the disease ever play itself out in maybe having the shakes or having a certain
degree of withdrawal or were you still too young?
I think I was still too young. My liver was kind of fresh. And on top of that somehow
physical activity helped me a little bit to just get worn out as quick as I could. But
I did not feel something like that. But probably a lot of anxiety and just sudden rage that
was picking up or coming out of nowhere. That probably the mind part was playing a role
in there, but nothing physical as far as I recall.
Where did the rage play itself out?
Whenever I was confronted or probably under a critical situation in which fear or self-doubt
might get in my sleep in, I was overreacting and trying to defend my point or to state
my perspective about any kind of situation in a probably or exaggerated way.
Sounds like a real effective way to keep people away and feel like you're continuing
to manage your life.
Exactly. Exactly. And on top of that being the person in charge, of course that was giving
me some fuel to just keep my denial as strong as possible. I'm supposed to do this. You're
wrong. I am the right guy.
So it sounds like an egomaniac's field day. I get that. So you're going through, you're
in this job, you're continuing to drink when you're off. When did you first notice that
alcohol was starting to become a problem for you?
Well after some international assignments and having the chance to go and try other
things in other different places, having more opportunities and options that I thought it
was part of my path as a functional alcoholic as you just reminded me to as a definition.
I start feeling like regardless of the place, this was going to Vegas, going to Miami, going
to New York, going to a lot of places in Europe, South America, trying to find the best places,
best people, most beautiful girls, most expensive and fanciest bottles and services in nightclubs.
But noticing that people were somehow taking advantage of me and I was ending up in the
same sad and shameful spot over and over again. Doing the same things, expecting different
results, but getting the same of course. A definition, and still a known definition of
insanity, but definitely it was not taking me nowhere despite I was trying literally
anything everywhere to make my life better or get a grip on it.
Can you give me an example or two of what that looked like while it was happening? You
mentioned trying different places, different behavior, more money, whatever else going
on. Can you give me some examples of what that looked like as it was happening for you?
Absolutely. Well, I was still living in Venezuela. It was pretty fun and I was planning in the
middle of my hitch, let's say my time on duty. It was 14, 21 or 28 days in which I was supposed
to be focused. In my job, I was planning my spree in advance. Probably a couple of trips
with two to three or four girls, going to three or four places, and of course drinking
pretty much every single day, literally speaking. At that time, he was not drinking by units.
He was large amounts. He was not a drink. He was by the bottle, by the case, by the largest
amount available. I was planning in advance. Whenever I was returning that very first day,
I was just hitting the road, making my way either to a nightclub, to another city, jumping
on a plane with a few girls and going to the beach, driving, whatever, just to kind of
catch up with that portion of life that I wasted or lost while I was working. That happened
initially in Venezuela, which was pretty fun until he was safe or reasonable to do so and
then it started happening in other places, Southeast Asia, North, South America, Europe,
etc. Then a later stage was between quite fun cities around the U.S., especially Miami.
I was making my rotations from and to Miami in order to just land and go. I made friends
with some nightclub owners, managers, nightlife promoters. I was kind of a decent guy and
well-known to go all over Miami with or without company. Initially, I was going out with my
friends from promotions and nightclubs business from Thursdays to Sundays. Then I met some
waitresses and bartenders, which is pretty much the core of the industry there, entertainment,
food and beverage business in the industry. I was hanging out with them from Monday to
Wednesday while my friends that were working in the industry were hiding from me because
I was going all day, every day.
So they didn't want to become like you or be sucked into your world at that point.
It's not that you're off. You're going to drag us to that mess on a daily basis.
It sounds almost like, as I said earlier, kind of like a bachelor's delight to be able
to go all around the world, go to nightclubs and hang out with fancy people and obviously
drop a lot of money along the way and so forth. When did that start to crash down around you?
It sounds like you were able to keep that going for a while.
I was, yeah. I kept that going for a couple of girlfriends in between, some breakups,
but still, it was not a big deal. I was still just doing, making my own way. But that happened
in a highly intense and frequent basis. Six to seven years, probably initially five before
I relapsed. But between 35 and my 40 years old, 40 years birthday, yeah, I just started
feeling that I was going nowhere. I was feeling deep inside of me, I was feeling in the same
exact way, sad, betrayed, used, that I was blowing a lot of money away unnecessarily
and somehow I started to ask because I came to know about 12-step programs from a friend
that shared the message with me after a breakup with a girlfriend that, funnily speaking,
she started drinking when she was 12. So it was a highly dysfunctional relationship and
after that I tried some other 12-steps fellowships, but that was not my core. I was still looking
people around me rather than looking inside of me.
At what point did you make the connection between the problems that you were having
and the need to get help for those problems?
Yeah, well, it was an inflection point between being that victim and being the accountable
guy. I was causing my own disaster and I was feeling that way because I was doing or coping
with the same behaviors over and over again. So definitely something else was happening
and that only else was myself. So I went, I finally felt like I wanted to die, like
in many other occasions and talk about this with this friend and we went to other 12-step
programs with, but I never wanted to go to my own 12-step program which was AA and finally
made it and I was back in Bogota by the grace of God and it was a Monday morning, 6 a.m.
group and that was my first twist and then impression of AA which was amazing, but unfortunately
I stopped going to meetings because I was not there and he gave me the impression to
okay, just try to find these kind of meetings, Spanish meetings in Houston, etc., etc. But
then I could not hold it anymore and I relapsed and somehow looked for help, went to a meeting
and I knew that if in 25 years of total full-blown single man spree, going all over the place,
trying so many things, wouldn't work. My kind of logic and God showed to me that nothing
will. So my only option was trying to look inside of me and that was AA.
That's interesting. You stayed sober for how long that first time around?
Less than a year, less than a year, but that relapse gave me a lot of strength and it simplified
my denial because I was just still trying to justify going here and there and the cool
part is that God did the job for me to just break out whatever reasons I might come up
with on the road way before I realized I was having a problem and I was pretty close or
ready to die anytime soon due to my obsessive mind and regular drinking patterns.
Did you notice that you weren't getting it the first time around in AA when you were
staying sober? Can you see the point at which you started heading towards that relapse instead
of towards stronger sobriety? No, I did not because I kind of felt a little
overconfident that I got it. Like I'm in AA, so I got it.
Yeah, I got it, but I just went a few meetings. I was not leaving AA. So I humbly believe
that I needed that relapse because when it happened, he was really silly. He was a friend
or a colleague that he was looking after me. He knew I was not doing the right thing and
that he was looking after me. He knew I was not drinking. I was just pretty much dry and
he was, no, but why are you not drinking? I cannot trust you if you don't drink. And
then one day having dinner, come on, it's just two glasses of wine. And I was full
vision of just to say yes to that glass of wine. That's how I shamefully relapse, but
that was a wake up call for sure. And that reinforced my powerlessness and how close
it was to just lost everything I got in my life, literally speaking.
You know, oftentimes when people relapse, what helps bring them back a little bit more
quickly was they did pick up something during their time with AA that even after the
relapse comes back to help them get back into the program. What had you learned the first
time in AA that made it possible for you to survive the relapse and get back to AA?
Well, I think the quality of examples I was surrounded with back in Colombia, you know,
communities in South America are quite strong, but they're not as formal and available as
they might be in other places. But the base, foundation of these groups are really committed
and program living kind of guys. So that gave me an amazing impression. I knew I was
one of them. I was just not around them long enough because I needed to go to work and
I still had that little portion, like I said, of higher power. That was my job. That of
course I need to go this time and that time and jumping in a chopper, going across the
top, da da da. That put me aside of a full surrendering behavior or attitude until I
got here and finally. So how long did the relapse last? Seven months because it was
September 2017 until April 2018. And then finally ended up going to the first meeting
that popped up in my mobile on Thursday night feeling like I wanted to die like I did the
first time I went to an AA meeting and by the grace of God, I just desperately share
without even being called. I just raised my hand and I shared with them that I wanted to
die and I felt horrible, et cetera, et cetera. And right after that meeting, my sponsor just
approached me and my actual sponsor and how are you? He noticed my accent so he knows
some Spanish. He's an English speaking native but he knows pretty decent Spanish. He noticed
my accent. He approached me. He asked me about my sponsor and I told him, no, he's here,
there. I'm your sponsor. So he was pretty old fashioned and to the point and then a good
group of solid sobriety guys surrounded me on that meeting and then just started my way
going pretty much meeting a day or more here in Houston and that has been my biggest blessing
and now my way of living just now. That's amazing that you've been able to put together
five years after a relapse that most people don't survive their relapses. I mean we do
get a chance to see people who come back but people say I've never seen somebody come back
to AA and say how great it was out there but then why would they come back to AA? If it
was great, why would they want to come back to AA? So the people whose relapse stories
we get to hear, you and I get to hear in these meetings, some of those people don't make
it back and it sounds to me like you might have been one of those people had not you
been found by this group of people and a sponsor who was very forthright and I know your sponsor
is and the fact that he said who you got as a sponsor and he didn't believe what you
said because it was clear that you probably didn't really have a sponsor. Somehow he was
far away and you know he tried it but he was not really playing a role and I kind of felt
that because whenever I was writing something in terms of steps I was kind of showing it
to him but he was probably busy somewhere else and I definitely needed a higher level.
He was not on all my own kind of deal so I needed solid and like a good friend of ours
in this program told me a couple days ago I need hardcore sponsorship.
Yeah and hardcore sponsorship is necessary for hardcore alcoholics and I get that. So
what was it like for you working the steps? How long did it take you to feel like you
had sufficiently worked through the first 12 steps?
My sponsor helped me a lot and he was very patient and open minded because I was still
on the go. My life's been like that in the last 20 years. I've been a rotator so half
of my life away, half of my life in town. So being a rotator it took us almost two years
to get it done because I was working 28, 28 or 35, 35 going overseas but the one great
thing was that he was still not retired back then and he was setting aside part of his
weekend and spending some of his time off just to sit with me, walk me through the reading,
walk me through the steps. He was probably not as efficient but he was really genuine
and probably what I needed because I might deny I was ready to jump in. So after two years
and kind of honesty and pretty solid guidance, especially in step four, that was overall
what it took and then step 12 I've been willing, probably not ready but willing for a while
and then my first Ponzi came out a few months ago and I was happy to hear from him after
we just got started. He relapsed. He told me and we just had a pretty powerful meeting
yesterday covering something and sharing. He invited me to a meeting and I was feeling
grateful. He was not looking that engaged. One of you guys told me, okay, talk to him
and see which are the reasons. I was a man so I cannot have no moral to point the finger
at nobody. That's one good thing that my spam of tolerance would be quite wide because
I clearly remember who I was so I might have good examples and experiences to share now
to this guy and probably in future to a few others. So that was really powerful. He's
on his way to work now but we had a great chat and we shared a meeting yesterday and
I think he might cover step one so we'll just have a chat about it in the next couple
of days but it was a deep and very spiritual feeling of his little progress and commitment.
He already went by his 90 and 90 mark. He's 107 days sober or so and so I think he got
at this time a lot of rubbish in his plate but trust in God.
You know what you've just been describing. That's beautiful what you just said. What
you've just been describing are the gifts of Alcoholics Anonymous. The fact that you
got a sponsor who was interested enough in staying sober himself to know that he had
to help another alcoholic to do that and so then he becomes the gift to you making time
in the midst of his day to give to you and then teaching you through that process how
to be a sponsor to the next man and then so you've described the gifts on really both
ends of that encounter and it's really beautiful for me to see you working that whenever I
see you. I know that you can always tell the quality of a man's sobriety by looking at
the guys he sponsors because usually those guys are walking around pretty confident,
feeling pretty secure because they know they got a sponsor. Their back is covered in a
big way. Do you get the feeling that way? It touches my heart because he was that kind
of guy. I was and I still feel proud of him. He introduced me to two of my great sponsors.
They are remarkable in this program, my humble opinion. They have been a great example to
me and they're pretty solid and kind of respected in this community so that to me is a big
blessing and one funny part is that my sponsor when he met my sponsor he was like hmm because
my sponsor tried to be playful and he didn't like it so he might be a tough one. Well, so I was.
So are you. You're the same guy. He didn't say nothing but it was a good way and a wise way just to.
That's great. That's great. Sounds like you've been doing what you need to do. What kind of
challenges have you faced in the last five years that strained your sobriety or that got you
thinking off the grid or considering that maybe this is not all that's cracked up. Maybe you
encountered challenges like that. What did they look like? Well, it's a funny question because I
did share about it on Tuesday and I'm just trying to summarize but I would say the most critical
but miraculous stages happen kind of in three parts but they are the different but as powerful
values each other from you know each of them. So I would say the most critical but miraculous
stages happened kind of in three parts but they are the different but as powerful values
each other from you know each of them. So the first one I would say was the pandemic. It caught me on
the way. I was away from home so it was almost a year without seeing my relatives or
friends. Of course staying away from my AA community. Going from one
work to another. Right when the pandemic hit I was abroad. I was in the Middle
East so the company I was leaving did not look after me for accommodation and food so I was paying
for my own food and accommodation for four months and a half in Dubai. Sending money out
to South America to help my mom which was there. She was supposed to but she was there for a short
visit and ended up being 18 months there and then staying paying for all my bills and expenses
here in Houston and that was kind of challenging because my income stopped at the beginning of that year
and it went for more than six months. My contingency fund was kind of there but it was not
sufficient to cover that in that proportion in a decent way but somehow made it through. So that
was a big learning then. With that I was going into another assignment
and my first work after the pandemic was requiring me to be self-isolated for 14
days in a hotel room with army vigilance or surveillance 24-7 so I was not able to
leave my room for 14 days and it was quite challenging for some other people that even quit it like my
supervisor mentioned it back then but they just took away their lives. I was staying in a
hotel room under heavy surveillance for 14 days just in order to get offshore
for a double hitch which was not 28, it was 56 days. So I was 14 days
of self-isolation before going offshore for 56 days altogether.
Wow, so all that was brought up by the pandemic.
Yes, so that took place for more than a year and it was quite challenging. If it wasn't for the program
I wouldn't be here because it was a lot of anxiety and uncertainty
shuffling around that I was somehow getting obsessed with but that taught me
how to trust God for nothing obvious to me and I was just feeling grateful waiting on God, trusting
God somehow, not really clear about it but walking through some streets that nowadays are
some interesting streets that I will tell you right after this second part
which was more than a year and a half without an income for the first time in my life
waiting from one assignment to the next that before I was just going from one to another assignment
non-stop despite I was highly dysfunctional and an active alcoholic but I did overreacted
I was doing the right thing but I probably I was not feeling like working in that place
after my supervisor retired they offered me his position which was an honor for me
but I didn't want to live on a residential basis in the Middle East, not at least full time
at that age so things changed and they tried to push me to do wrong things for the sake of economics
and I refused to do that so they started putting a lot of pressure and said okay
that's good for you not for me so we better just get to a mutual agreement
so we kind of both agreed to leave it that way and I just leave that assignment
and it took me more than a year and a half to get my next one but in between
God laid or deployed a solid foundation between steps 3 and 11 because I was thanking and trusting him
and hearing over and over again from you guys that God will come up with something
that I will never imagine and better than expected that became the rule of my inner thoughts
on a daily basis they get healthier and I was able to help my old folks from Colombia
to lead meetings the meetings are so small that sometimes they cannot cover from Monday to Friday
and I was taking Thursdays for more than seven months and I stayed there
so it was it was a beautiful opportunity and then the very place I was walking
without a clear clue of what my future would be like right after the pandemic
is the very place that I'm working right now with one of the biggest blessings
and probably dream assignment in my whole career of 20 years
that's amazing that's such a success story that only a good AA program could write
and I love to hear that it sounds to me like you had the willingness and the patience
and the reliance upon a power greater than yourself in such a way that these things materialized for you
that God was doing for you what you could not do for yourself
that's a that's a major promise sounds like it's been fulfilled in your life
thankfully I can definitely agree on that and it is like my my great sponsor say once
I do blindly trust this program and that's something that resonated in my mind
and I still reserve a pretty decent grip on it and on top of that
you know somehow being as a stubborn and probably as denial ready as I could be
God just taught me to trust him for nothing
but at the same time that nothing that I think it is it is everything for him
but it's not my time to know yeah that's beautiful
your whole story today has really made me feel very encouraged about the type of things
that can happen to a man and he can still stay sober through them
the fact that you physically could not even go to AA meetings and staying sober
I think that's a great message for people who think if I am not at a place that I can go to a meeting
I might drink you've proven otherwise you were out of work for a long period of time
but you had the faith that something was going to happen and it did
these are all messages to the next person who hears this and I don't know who's going to hear this particular podcast
but the thing that I know now about you because you and I haven't had the opportunity to really share like this before
is that you are a great example of alcoholics anonymous and God at work in a man's life
you've acknowledged where the gifts came from
and the fact that you still recognize that it's God who's running the show is a beautiful thing to behold
and I want to thank you for sharing that with me today
I want to tell you that I respect and honor your sobriety
I love you you're a good member of our group and sounds to me like you're staying pretty close to the program
and again I want to thank you so much for doing this
thank you Howard thanks for the opportunity and for having me today
okay you bet thank you
well my friends that's a wrap for today's episode of AA recovery interviews
I want to thank my guest Diego R. for sharing his story and thank you for tuning in
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