Step 4 Inventory and Fifth Stepping – Emotional Sobriety – the Next Step – Part 2 of 4 – Bob D.

Thank you very much. while. What have we dealt with? We've been talking about inventory, right? Something that I didn't mention is how to set yourself up for inventory. This is what I currently do and have been doing. If I'm going to write inventory, I say a set-aside prayer. There's one, I think I threw one in the guide. A version of a set aside prayer. Ask God to set aside what I think this process is going to be. I ask God to remove my fear of what I'm to see about myself, and I ask God to show me what I need to see. Show me His truth. What is it that has to come out in this inventory? When I sit down and start writing the process, I do it just as it is out of the book. Column 1, person-institution principle. Colum 2, you work vertically. I don't write horizontally. I don' t say column 1, column 2, column 3, column 4 and then try to get back to column 1 again. It doesn' t work that way for me. I write vertically. I write all of my column 1s. All the people, persons, institutions, principles. Then I go to column 2. What did they harm me and then I go to column three. And I work it across. When I read inventory, I read it horizontally. Column one, column two, column three, column four. Next. Boom. That way. I ask God to take me into that space. If for some reason I don't finish that inventory for whatever reason, just like we end the meetings here, I stop. I ask god to take me out of the place that I write inventory from. Keep me safe and protected until I can come back and be with him to write more inventory. Why do I do that? Because I guarantee you if you don't do this You will ask God to take you into the place of inventory. You will write inventory, put it down and say, I'm tired, let's go to a meeting. You will go to an event. You'll go to the meeting and they'll say, hey, you got a topic? And it'll be something that's going on in your inventory. And you'll raise your hand and you will fifth step with a group. And you had absolutely no intention of fifth stepping with that group. And it will destroy you. And you won't realize that you created your own problem because there will be a trust issue. Now you hear it come out of your mouth and you can't get it back. And now you can'T trust your own home group because now you don't want to be there because they know something about you and they know this deep intimate secret because you haven't finished the inventory. You haven't gone through all the fears and cleaned the rest of it up on a one-on-one. Once you've done that, you've given it to God, you've fifth-stepped it formally, most people, who cares if they hear it? It doesn't matter. It's God's. It doesn'T own them anymore. So ask God to take you into the place to write inventory. Ask Him to take it out of that place once you're done. All right? There's been a couple questions. On the example I gave you in the short form, if you go to the page in the guide, which I believe is like page 10, if I'm not mistaken. It's on page 11. All right? This is an example of a short form filled out. Remember how I do use a short from. The guy, they fill out column 1. They fill out volume 2. They hand it to me. I check off column 3. You'll notice the top of column 3 there, there's A, B, C, D, E, F, G. That corresponds to the left-hand margin, A,B,C,D,E,F,G. So every checkmark in the vertical A column has to do with mom, the resentment with mom. Did it affect my self-esteem, my pocketbook, my ambition, my personal relations, sex relations, right down that line? You'll notice under pocketbook there's an at symbol. Put the at symbol there because when she forgot me at the store as a child may or may not affect your pocketbook. It's a question mark. Depends on the inventory. how could your mom abandon you forgetting you at the store and that feeling of abandonment you had affect your pocketbook well if you carry 20 bucks in your pocket to this day because you're never going to be left out without a way to get home it's affected your pocket book alright there's somebody in my life that used to get thrown out of the house constantly as a child to this today to this very day they always carry their pocketbook with them they carry it because they're afraid of still getting thrown out of their house It's an unconscious behavior. It's affected their pocketbook, literally. So it may or may not. Look at the Resentment Bee. Dad, he beat me when I broke the car. It may or might not affect your pocketbook. It depends how old you are. If because he beat you when you broke his car, when you borrowed it, you smashed it, let's say you hit a mailbox, you broke the side mirror off and he came home and he gave you a big whooping. Man, he whooped up on you for that. And you said, I will never borrow that man's car again. And then you work like a dog washing dishes so that you're going to get your own car. So you never had to rely on him again. Guess what? It affected your pocketbook. All right? If he felt so bad because of the beating he gave you that he didn't make you pay for it and you fixed it up, maybe it didn't. Maybe he continued to borrow the car and it didn'T really have an effect on your pocket book. You can see where I'm going with that? It may or may not. It all depends on the situation. And as the fifth stepper, the guy's bringing you the fifth step, you have to hear it and ask the questions and delve into that some more. Don't just say because the guy says, oh, it didn't affect my sex relations. Go after it. Do you smell more? Is there more to that deal? There may be more that you're going to have to take a look at. I get into an altercation at an AA meeting. Somebody comes up and challenges me, and we have a disagreement, the big I am, right? And I go down and I write my inventory. It affected my self-esteem, yep. Affected my pocketbook, nope. Affect my ambition, yep, my personal relations, yep my sexual relations, nope, wait a minute because I had a fight with Rashid at an A meeting maybe well if I go home and start bitching to my wife the victim oh you wouldn't believe what Rashid did to me at the meeting he made me look like an idiot guess what Do I feel like getting any that night? No. Am I being completely dishonest with my wife? Absolutely. I didn't bring a whole person to the relationship. I brought the victim to the relationship, and I'm expecting, I'm demanding her 100% loyalty in that frame of mind. The victim wants 100% royalty. I want her to take my side and to stroke the back of my head and say, honey, it's okay, let me rub your feet and scratch your back. Remember my language of love, physical touch. I'll make it okay. He was the big bad Rashid. He shouldn't have done that, you know? If on the other hand she looks at me and says, grow up, guess what? Now it's multiplied. I got two resentments, all right? Let's say that happens at a noon meeting, you know, lunchtime meeting. Now it is 10 o'clock at night and we are getting going to bed and you think she is a little bit frisky, do you think I am not just going to roll over and turn the light off, and I'll show her. Hit man, right? She ain't getting none. I'm not even going to talk to her. Why? Because that resentment with Rashid has affected my sex life now. Rashid's in bed with me, and I don't even say it. Right? All right? Powerful stuff, but you need to understand what's going on here with inventory. Fears, face and be rid of. Fear, fear, fear. Any way you can get to a fear, it's the key to your sobriety, the fear tool. Whether you come from the second step proposition, whether you come through a normal fear inventory, whether you come form prayer meditation, however you get to the fear, get rid of the fear because why? Fear is a conscious decision, right? The big book says it ought to be classed with stealing. How can fear be class with stealing? When I steal something, if I'm going to steal this, I grab it, I take it. I made a conscious decision to take it well. If I've made a conscience decision in fear, what is that decision that I'm making? I'm the decision to rely on myself rather than to rely on God where my ultimate power comes from. Fear is a conscious decision. All right. And then the sex ideal, though some people have asked a question on the sex I deal, who is BTK? BTK are my wife's initials. So when you're reading that and it looks down and says BTK, people are going, whoa, what is that? This reminds me, anybody that didn't get any of this stuff and you're interested in it, my email address is aadave1 at aol.com. If you're interesting in any of the stuff, I will email it to you. If you want the traditions and relationships, I'll email that to you if you want to know if you don't want the concepts and relationships I'll e-mail that to you. And if you ask for the concepts and relationships you got to read the fine print because it talks in there about 1988 the concepts of world service uses a different date I'm applying the 12 concepts to my relationship 1988 was the year that I got married so I substitute that date that's when I formed the spiritual union like it talks about in the 12 Concepts of AA that's what I did that's where we gave world service over that's why we forward our spiritual union so I use my spiritual union with my wife that's how I start to apply it so in case you ask for the concepts Email again is aadave1, the numeric one, at AOL.com. I feel really sorry for the guy who's A.A. Dave because he gets a lot of bizarre emails. Any questions on inventory? Now's the time. It's fresh in your mind. We're going to have an open panel tonight, but there's � I've been getting lots of little questions from people. and the question that you have may be the same question that they have and the only dumb question is the question that doesn't get asked I always like to do this before we move from inventory to fifth stepping because the inventory really is the key to your future if you can crack the inventory nut your life is an oyster man you can do whatever you need to because anything that knocks you off from your relationship with God you can get right back up on the beam speaking of that expression does anybody know what being on the bean means yes radio track since i'm a pod i might as well explain that the old days before navigation they had am radios right the old-fashioned am radials and they realized that they sent a frequency out in two different ways two exact opposite frequencies they would cancel each other have one sign over here and one sign every day if you heard da da da you knew you were to the left of course if you hear dash dash dash dash, dash, you knew we were on the right side of the course. If you didn't hear anything, you were on the radio beam. Emmett Fox talks about being off the radio boom. Guess what? Bill Wilson stole it from Emmett Cox. It's in our big book. You're on. Oh, is there a question? You're not supposed to put yourself on the resentment list. Oh, great question. Not supposed to put yourself on the resentment list Did you harm yourself? Yes. I allow people to put them on there. Put it on there, I put it on their. Alright? But what was Mark talking about? Were you doing the very best you could as asleep as you were? Yep. So here's what I do. Guys bring me that and I have one guy who brought me like nine pages of self-resentment. Oh, well, it's me, I'm the worst person. We don't ever want to be middle of the road. I'm not going to do that. I'm going to be the worst person in the world. I've done this, I've been that and you know what? He hands it to me and I looked at him and I said, oh, that's nice And I took a big X and I went through each of the nine pages. And every X, the guy's eyes got bigger and bigger and larger and bigger. And he's going, what are you doing? And I said, forgive yourself and move on. You were doing the absolute best you could with what you had at the time. How are you going to make amends to yourself for the harm you caused? Four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve. Right? Plug into God. Do the best you can with what voc� tem. and you'll make that amend up. Hand. I want to read out a third column. There's something weird I can find out. Oh, a written third column? Yeah, the question was some people like to write that third column You heard me reference this as a short form there's a long form where people will actually write out the selfishness and how it affected you and they'll write out how it effected your sex relations, personal relations Take a guy he's walking in the door he's a brand new sober and he's got 400 resentments If you sit him down with long form and you turn him loose, A, it's going to take him weeks to right that. And B, I guarantee he's going run out of energy and he's going to die in the process. You're going to kill him. And the way I know that is I've done it. Unfortunately, I had to learn the lesson the hard way. I take guys through and I get them some relief right away. Get them back in inventory as quick as I can. But get them through their amends. Get them right back in inventories six months later. Do that cycle maybe once or twice. Now we've got something to work with. He's got a conscious contact, he's got some tools. Now let's sit down and take our time. Now, instead of having 300 resentments, this inventory that I just did had 9 resentments. Man, I did long form. And it's sitting up here if you want to take a look at it. I don't own it anymore, it's God's. That's probably 60 sheets on 9 resentment. Could you imagine what that would look like for 400? I mean, that's 6 reams of paper, for God's sakes. and you've got a dead alcoholic at the end of it because he's not going to make it. And in the process, his ego will figure out a way to wrap it around and attack him from behind and he won't see it. And then A, he's no longer going to work. That's what he's going to tell you. By the way, if you've Got Anything, jump in, man. Hand in the back. When do I recommend somebody do steel on steel? My experience is steel on steal, for those of you who don't know, I was going to talk about this later on, and we will go into it in more detail. Steel-on-steel is basically like a fifth step. It's you getting together and you have spiritual commitment with each other to pull each other towards God. Which means, for me, my experience is, you need to have a relationship with God. So until you've done inventory, you don't have a friendship with God? So I like to tell people that if you want to do steel-on steel, finish your amends, get through the ninth step, and go do it. I've seen people that are almost done with their amends who are able to start steel on steel, although it's few and far between. Guys that are still carrying guilt and remorse of the harms and they haven't cleaned it up, their ego will use that and they'll get into steel on steal and the next thing you know it's three years later and they still haven't finished up the last three amends. Finish the amends and then jump into steel-on-steel and it's like doing a regular inventory on a regular basis. At least that's my experience. What's yours with that, Mark? It's the very same. As iron sharpens iron, so one man or one woman sharpens another. I'll share a little bit about that right now, I guess. Why not? When I got down to Kerrville, Texas in 91, 92, I think, I guess, and Chris can tell you this, I guess I'd been down there about two years, and I got very, very clear that my self-delusion and sobriety had almost killed me. And I also got very clear that the idea of one man, say a sponsor, being able to help me with that was placing a burden on someone that I had no business placing. So I was doing some 11-step reading one night, and I like to read Proverbs. I like stories, and Proverbs is stories. So I'm reading Proverbs, and proverbs 2717 says, As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. and uh man that that wouldn't leave me and so i thought you know i'm going to do something with that so i got a hold of chris and another gentleman i sponsor uh dale and another man dan and uh trying to think who else may excuse me there's one other one oh yeah the gentleman at that time who had some of the longest sobriety in that town uh who incidentally after a period of time left steel and steel because his ego could not handle it he could not tackle the considerations that he was posed by somebody who was much younger in sobriety than him and so we had the first meeting and uh basically here's the format that we utilize we like to open with some meditation um today i have a two-page form that i use and uh we use timers one of the things that that i've learned again i guess this is about simplicity but um i'm a bullet person And alcoholics, I can always tell when an alcoholic is going to justify selfishness because before they ever get to what it is they're going to tell me, they go through a 15-minute explanation laying out the nine-course dinner. And then they tell me what I'm going to eat, and that really makes me gun shy. So in Steel on Steel we use a timer, and you only get 10 minutes. And we start out, and currently what we do right now is I talk about, first of all, where am I exactly with the circle and triangle? How many meetings have I gone to? Right now I'm meeting every two weeks with two men. How many meanings have I gotten to in the last 14 days? In the last four days, this is back to discipline as the horse I ride. How many morning prayers did I do? How many more meditations? How long were these meditations how many evening reviews that I do in my doing a a written evening review how many evening meditations did i do what was the length of those where are each of the people i sponsor in the steps am i accountable as a sponsor am i accountable to someone specifically what step am i on um and then it goes on once once they're done asking questions about the strict disciplines of 10 11 and 12 then it go It goes on to say, are you having any problems in relationships, i.e., work, co-workers, A.A., etc.? Then it says, what's going on in your significant other relationship? Then it gets into money. Are you planning to spend any money over $200? We threw that in there right now because two of the men that I'm doing this with have unfinished financial amends. So right now they both have everything they need. So if they are there, I got them to agree that before they'll ever spend any sum of money over 200, they'll call the other two men and seek counsel because what that means is since they still owe amends, they would be once again stealing from these same people they've already stolen from once. And so that's in there. Are you planning any purchases over $200? See, I can see some of you already going, who wants that kind of accountability, right? In there is your physical health. What's going on with your physical health? And we talk about that. When I started Steel on Steel, I weighed probably about 250 pounds. I had great medical insurance and I hadn't had a physical in probably 10 years. I mean it was unbelievable to us and so we begin to ask these questions and I'm here to tell you as a result of steel and steel I get yearly physicals every year dermatologist I take good care of myself in that area with the exception of smoking so the physical health piece is on there what are you doing with that then we like to work with the definition of honesty say what you do, do what you say how have you been doing withthat say whatyou do,do what yousay And you take a look at that every area of your life. Are you getting to work on time, etc.? Then the last question on the form that we use is, do you keep your word? And then we've got some little reminders. Use the word consider, done in love, that kind of stuff. Then what happens is I shut the timer off, I pull out a notebook. And those two men, based on everything that I've shared, will ask me to consider some things. See? I'll give you an example of some of the considerations. One that they gave me about a month ago is they wanted me to consider a lot less travel and a lot more involvement in AA where I live. So I write that down, consideration. And, of course, I'm sober much longer than both these guys, so I have to look at them and thank them. Because our agreement is you cannot defend because the ego wants to defend. What else did they ask me to consider? They asked me to consider that maybe I was working with too many people, that I was placing too much of a burden on myself with my career and trying to work out and do this and do that and do That. So I'm writing these considerations down. When we're done with that, then what I did is for the next two weeks, I took those considerations into prayer and meditation and I can tell you that I made some decisions off that. That very next week, I went to five meetings. See, steel and steel allows me to defeat my ego and use it to my benefit. If you all think I'm showing up at steel and steal with two guys with less sobriety and they're going to confront me again about not having enough meetings in my own hometown, you are wrong. I'm going to go to that meeting even if I don't want to be there. See? That's how steel and still can benefit. But I'll tell you off that already, I did cancel a bunch of stuff. Stealing and steal is one of the most important practices I've ever had in my life. And I've had it pretty well consistently since about 1994. That kind of accountability, unbeknownst to me, where you've got to understand, if you do what I'm talking about, there isn't any secrets in your life, are there? And they're asking you to consider things. And really, over the years, what it did is it just totally opened up my ego, if you will. But most alcoholics, when they hear about this format, they don't want anything to do with it because we lead secret lives, financial, you name it. And we don't we don'T want that kind of accountability. My self-delusion, my unwillingness to face that kind OF accountability, I told you where it got me in 10 years. I love that kind Of accountability. I love that kind of discipline. Now, understand something else. We do steal and steal from an avenue of love. Now, I'm not here to try and tell anyone what they have to do with their life. By virtue of self-delusion, meaning I fall asleep dreaming I'm awake, steal and steel is about are you asleep to this? See? I was asleep to the idea that as you begin to get older in your life, it's probably a good idea to go get a yearly physical. So that by the time you find out you have cancer, your whole body is not full of it. Just little simple things like that that I was asleep to, right? So that's what we do. We currently meet every two weeks. But as you can see, it covers every area of my life. Now, there's a strange thing about this. Surprisingly enough, the first half of this form that I like to use is all the things that we need to do is stay in fit spiritual condition, right, Now, strangely enough, when I report and I'm doing all those things, the second half of my life, which is that I'm in the world to play the role that God has assigned, it seems very clean and very smooth and very peaceful. Surprisingly enough, the first half has a bunch of holes in it, like I only meditated two times last week. I went to one meeting. I'm not sure what step I'm on. I'm working with anyone. it is incredible what the bottom half looks like, meaning your job and relationships and physical health. So when I meet with the men that I work with, and I do that fairly religiously, they always bring that form with them, and they know me well enough. If they've got a bunch of holes in the top half, I will not talk to them about the bottom Half. Don't talk to me about your relationship with your girlfriend when you've been unwilling to do the disciplines of 10 to 11 for a week. Get out of my house. See? Get outofmyhouse. I'm not going to talk about it. It's just dribble. It's a waste of time. See? Go on. Just get away from me. I don't want what you... Get outa here, see? Because what's going to happen as a result of not doing the disciplines, then what have they taken into that area of their life? Their selfishness and their self-will. So what they're going to report back is, well, we had this big fight, this blowout, and my employer's all pissed off, and I haven't been feeling good physically, and I'm lethargic. And I go, oh, let's see, no prayer, no meditation. Gee, I wonder if there's any connection here, right? And so at any rate, that's what steel and steel is. That's how I use it. Again, I will tell you, it's one of the best disciplines I've ever brought into my life. It has helped me beyond belief. I mean, Chris, who you'll hear tonight, will tell you he and I were involved in that for years. And you develop a closeness, a caring, a compassion. See, you know, Dave brought up something, and this is so important. Here's these people in his group watching him drift off into la-la land that he could drink behind and nobody's saying anything to him. You know, and steel and steel ultimately for me became a vehicle in which men that I cared about and loved about deeply, areas in which they would fall asleep, think they were dreaming, they were awake. I could bring that to their attention. I did that in the spirit of love. I didn't do it in the Spirit of Judgment. I didn' t do it, you know, in anything else. So that's a little bit about steel on steel. I think Dave brought some forms which are pretty similar to the ones I have and I use for it. I can tell you from my experience if you get more than about four people It's just about too many. It may take too long, and I'll be happy to answer any other questions about that during the course of the weekend. And I guess we are just about ready to eat dinner. So then tonight you're going to get the Chris R. show. I guess ??'re goingto break for a couple hours, if I understand that, and meet back here at 7. Okay? I got just one more thing to add to Steel on Steel since we're talking about it. But Steel on Steel, when I first started it, I chose three people to do it with. There's a magic of the number of four. I've done it in different size groups. There's an example of that. There's the magic of four don't ask me what it is. It's just my experience. A three oftentimes you'll get a consideration where you'll say this. They'll say one guy will say, well, is it possible that you need to do this? And the other guy will Say, is It possible you need to do that and they're diametrically opposed. So who's going to break the tie? If two guys are saying, is it possible over here? One guy's saying, Is it possible over here?" Chances are you're hearing the voice of God and you kind of get an idea where you need to go. So there's a magic of the number of four. Second item. Don't be surprised if you change. Do not attempt steel on steel if you don't want to change. Because remember, God's grace lasts only as long as ignorance. They will show it to you. We call them IIP questions. Everything's in the form of, Is It Possible? IIP colon. Boom. Is it Possible that you need to look at this? Is it possibly that? You get an unlimited amount of time to report back to the group on the questions I gave you last time. Well, you asked me about this and here's what I did. You asked me that and here is what I said. Then I ask the question, is there anything I didn't cover that you want to hear about from last time I shared? Then we hack the clock and you've got ten minutes. The reason for the ten minutes is absolutely critical because in ten minutes your ego doesn't have the opportunity to set up a story to make you look a certain way. You've got to put the truth on the table and you're going to put it on the tab right now. and the last thing is steel on steel is about commitment don't come to my steel on steal group with the same problem month after month after months after month it's about change you know um and there are no holds barred every door is open we talk about sex specifically how is it going on in your life we talk About the internet we talked about masturbation if it's going on we talked About the dirty nasty deeds that are going on how's the hairy eyeball you're talking about that summertime you're at the beach on vacation were you having a problem with that you know were you mentally undressing other women what's going on in your life we talk about every possible thing that can come up on the table and it's all open for discussion when i first started my first steel and steel group the wives of the guys that are in my steel and steal group were saying wow this is pretty cool and all of a sudden these guys started growing really fast and it puts a lot of pressure inside a relationship when you start doing what's right Because now you're holding up the spiritual mirror, right? And next thing you know, the wives are, I mean, I'm not sure if I want this to continue. Some of them. Some of the other ones. My wife begs me for steel on steel because she sees the benefits. If I miss a steel on steal meeting, she's like, when's the next meeting? And she'll arrange her whole schedule to open up a hall. I'll cover the kids. You got steel and steel right here, okay? She's a tremendous support for steel. Changed my life. Try it. But you've got to want to change. All right? The forms are pretty specific. I give you, it's a whole meeting package. There's the reading that we intro with. There's a description of Steel on Steel, what Steel on Seal is about, what it's not about. And then lastly, there's a reading that ?? do out of the big book, which is from page 62 forward. And it talks about why we're there and who the problem is and where do we get the power from. Something I just added to Steel on steel. All of us happen to be Christian in our Steel on Steal group. at the end of our steel on steel now we started to break bread together you want a powerful spiritual experience if you have something like that that's part of your religion do it together as a group we openly pray together we pray for each other we have prayer lists that go on for each another for the problems that are in each other's lives it's dramatic the way it's affected my life and the areas that it has changed I can't say enough good stuff about it now it's not AA but man does it affect your AA You want to really get sharp? It's like doing a fifth step once a month. I happen to do it once a week. Once a month because of schedules. I wish I could do it every two weeks. It just doesn't work in my life that way. Everybody that I chose for Steel on Steel in my group, we're all basically the same. We're all within about 10 years of each other age-wise. We're both married. We're double-digit sobriety. We've all been going to couples meetings for a lot of years. I've been goingto couples meetings in AA for over 15 years. um two of the three of us have kids excuse me uh three of the four of us have kids one guy has since dropped out so i'm now back in a situation we have three of US and our steel and steel group and as a group we're trying to decide how we're going to handle that are we going to add somebody what are we gonna do right now we're going with it and seeing how it goes so it's an it's the ultimate challenge you know my sponsor used to my effect my home group I used to belong to this group that had an unwritten motto You think you're working the program? Show us your family and we'll tell you how well you're working the problem. Steel on steel, we'll really sharpen that up because you can't live in that state of disillusionment when you've got three other guys pulling you towards God. That's what it's all about. In the spirit of love, pulling each other shoulder to shoulder. Nobody's the sponsor. Nobody's a sponsee. Nobody'S the guru. NobodyS in charge except God. And that's what the deal is about. Let's go eat. Folic hope everybody's relaxed we're about to not get relaxed I'll give you a little idea of what the format tonight, we've got Chris to speak for the next hour or so and then Mark and Dave are going to come back and join him and a bunch of you filled out some questions that you gathered over the last day and a half that we had And I'm sure I saw people squirming in their seats a little bit, including myself. And it stirred up some questions, and they're going to try and answer some of them. And let's see. Why did we get Chris here? I guess real quick. The first time Dave handed me a tape of Chris's, and I was listening to it in the car, and I wasn't ready to just about drive over to the airport and get on a plane to Texas because I thought, but this guy needs help, he is angry. And then I put the tape on at home and I listened to what he said and I identified a lot and I felt exactly he wasn't angry, he was full of passion for this program, just like myself. And I couldn't deny a thing that he said. And he actually got me passionate again, more passionate for what this program has done for me. So we asked him to come down here and share his passion with us about what we've been talking about this weekend. So, Chris off. Can y'all hear me all right? I won't need this in a few minutes anyway. My name's Chris Raymer. I'm a recovered alcoholic who's fixing to lose his voice. This is something I picked up in Texas, I guarantee you. This is not anything I can't blame on New York. This is an amazing thing here. Give me a second. Man, I need to thank the cats that made this possible, Bart and Rick and all the buds, Denise. I travel a lot. I get to speak. I'm honored to get to do anything in Alcoholics Anonymous. I also speak some in our sister fellowships of Cocaine Anonymous, and I travel a lot and get to come to lots of conferences, and, of course, it's the obligatory thing to do. You know, oh, well, this is such a nice place, and you've been tortured all day long, but the truth is, I mean, this was so well organized and great service from top to bottom, and I'm honoured to be here. I'm blown away by New York. I got, you know, it's like every time I travel someplace, I says, well, Chris, you don't try not to act like a tourist, you know, but then, but how can we flew in over to LaGuardia last night and flew right over the city. And it's Like, you Know, Jeannie was my wife's here with me and she, she's, she've got the aisle seat. Right. And so it was like a minute. It was like, wait a minute, I'm the one that's speaking. I need the aisle seed. You know what I mean? I was like crawl over, you Know, we're looking out the windows. It's like y'all live in a tremendous place. I am blown away. Next time we'll come back and get to spend a little more time. Jeannie got to do some sightseeing today, and I got to sit and listen to two of my absolute heroes in this fellowship. Mark Houston is my sponsor, and he will keep me honest tonight, I guarantee you. And Dave, I met, I don't know, a couple years ago. I got a call out of the clear blue sky, and he says, Is this Chris Raymer? And he was in San Antonio, which is an hour drive from where I live, and I live in a little town called Ingram, Texas. It is just as country as can be. It's Ingram, Texas. We all have wives and date sheep there in Ingram Texas. I don't know. That's the first thing in divorce court. Was it a sheep or was it a real woman? It's pretty country. It's very stupid up there. And I'm sorry. But anyway, Dave came up and sat in a little big book with us And just out of clear blue showed up And we got to visit And he's been a bud ever since And I honor and respect him for carrying a message I need to tell you He spent a lot of time today apologizing right off the bat From cussing And the tone of his voice And the way he may have looked at you I'm not that spiritually fit I'm going to tell ya I'm gonna tell you going in the door It's going to be my attempt not to cuss I don't think it's respectful, but I can tell you right now, I'm going to fail miserably at it. So you might as well know. And if it offends you, go away. I don'T know what to tell you. I DON'T know WHAT TO TELL YOU. It'S a character defect that'S being removed from me. Not too damn quick, but IT'S being REMOVED. I DONT KNOW. Thirteen years ago, guys, God did a number on me. And after years in and out of the fellowship, he removed the obsession for me to drink and drug. And I'm pretty passionate about that. I've got a friend in Kerrville that said one time, he comes from Houston, and he said it's a tragedy that some of us in our fellowships have to feel out of place in our own fellowship, the fellowship that saved our life. We've got to feel uncomfortable in those rooms because the message we're carrying is so different from the message that most people are carrying out there. And that's the truth. It's sad that if you're a big book thumper in most parts of this country, you are ostracized. And I'm going to talk a little bit about this. And I want everybody, please, I'm not going to get long-winded. I can promise you I won't keep you here longer than about 45 minutes. And I am going to say some things tonight that I can assure you are going to... You know, you will either... You will either bond with me. We will share Christmas cards and swap spit. I mean, we will... We will, we will bond or you will do like happens every time I speak. I spend, I speak lots and lots folks, and I've never seen it fail. And you will, you will wait for me at the door and to take exception with something I've said. And I, and i'm down with that folks. I just want, I want to make it kind of clear here. You know, this is, this Is what the fellowships about y'all asked me to come up here and share my experiences. Dave alluded to it earlier. This is my experience. It doesn't have to be your experience. If what I say goes exactly against what you believe, that's one of the cool things about this deal. You can believe whatever you want to believe. If it's working for you, bop to your drop. But I need to tell you a couple of things right off the bat. You see, where my passion comes from, what Bart said is so true. It hurts my feelings sometimes because sometimes when people pick up tapes of mine, they don't know me and they don' t listen to the first part where I'm trying to explain where I' m coming from. All I hear is this guy screaming on the other end of the gutting phone. And he's like, this is one real angry individual, you know. And I'm going to tell you, I'm as quiet and shy as you can get. Right up to the point you want to start talking to me about this. And then a little something deep down inside says, this ist your chance, buddy. This is it, you see. You know? People have been dissing you all your life. Now, you can get even with them back. You get a chance to say, I nearly died getting to these rooms. My first attempt at Alcoholics Anonymous was about 1980, and I'm going to talk a little bit about that. But I'm in and out of the fellowship for years, and Jesus, it's just, you know, I walk into the rooms, and you tell me I'm always going to be recovering, and that I'm gonna have to admit that I don't know what to do. I'm powerless and then you start talking about every goddamn problem in the world and pretty soon you chase me out of the room. And then I come back in because I got arrested again or she's fixing to leave again, you know, and I made a new commitment. I'm going to come in and I'm Going to pick up another one of those stupid desire chips and then I'm Going to sit there and listen for another week while you tell your war stories over and over. We can all do it. You know, you can tell you're preaching to the choir in this room. I mean, it's like. And this is where I'm coming from, folks. At the end of that eight year stint in and out of the fellowship, I tried to commit suicide in 1987 and ended up back in a room full of people that were carrying big books and understood that you could recover from this stuff and that the book meant what it said and that if you had an opinion that was contrary to what the book said, you might want to keep it to yourself. I've got to wear cheaters, too. They say that they make these little monocles. I think that's what I need is a little monacle thing. I don't know. I need to show you this. I was reading this the other day. It's in Box 459. Alcoholics Anonymous produces it here. We may have somebody from Central Service. If you're in the audience tonight, since we're this close to New York, let's visit after the meeting. I have a message to give some of them fat cats back up there. I guarantee you. One of these little articles here, and this is where I'm coming from. I'm going to jump around a little bit, and I'm not going to get into this in just a second, but I need to explain it. It says, this is a little report from the General Service Board. He says, The GSO continues to be in good financial condition. The only worrisome trend is a long-term steady decline in sales of AA literature. I'm going to be speaking in tongues before this thing is 15 minutes into this thing listen folks if our only worry as a fellowship is that literature sales are a bit down shame on us we've got a fellowship that 66 years ago had a success rate of better than 75% in the midwest you can go to any archive around folks around Cleveland, Akron, they had success rates of nearly 100% in lots of areas. In the early days, the first few years of Alcoholics Anonymous, everybody that came through the door got sober. And right now in the United States, if you can find any place that's got a better than a 20% success rate, it's a miracle. You think we've got to... I mean, come on, folks, we've Got to Get Straight Here. Why am I so fat? People want to take shots at me all the time. Oh, Chris Ramer, you shouldn't be ripping AA books. You know, it's like I'm not, but this is my fellowship. And the fellowship as a whole needs to wake up and start looking and seeing what we're doing here. We are not getting well in AA. But you see where the controversy comes is because you got well in EA. You slipped under the door. You got through the crack. And you think everybody else should be able to do it. But the truth is all you've got to do is look at the success rates and stop making excuses. Walk into a meeting and just ask yourself. It's like is the message that we're hearing today in AA the same message that they heard 66 years ago? And you ask any of the old times, they'll tell you without a question, no, absolutely not. Absolutely not. I do clerical work for a treatment center in Texas and I am not a counselor or a therapist. I love counselors and I love therapy. And don't ever misquote me because I'll hunt you down and shoot you. I have taken more ribbons from that stuff where you hate therapy. I'm a product of good therapy, folks. I'm seeing one today about some other stuff, folks AA is not a catch-all for every problem in the world And shame on us for trying to make it A catch-off for every problems in the wold Y'all understand that? And see, this is what's happened to Alcoholics Anonymous And so I go into this treatment center And all of these cats are coming through We got about a thousand people through there a year And I'm asking these cats It's a high dollar facility And I said, buddy, did you ever go to AA? Oh yeah, we went to AA, it didn't work Oh, I see. Huh, damn. It worked for me. You know, so let's get on down there. Oh, no, it didn't work. And here's what they tell me, guys. And you can ask Mark. You can ask anybody that's around the business. You can Ask These Cats. What excuses are they using to not stay in AA? War stories and people pissing and moaning about their problems. And so I come up and speak from the podium around the country and Canada, wherever I'm speaking, and I talk about this and I offend people because you think it's your God-given right to walk into a meeting and puke all over the table and let somebody else clean it up. You think it is your right to turn my AA meeting into a damn therapy session. It is not. This is your cue. All you big boys that I have been tapping on the shoulder all day long, this is your queue to move forward now. Can you give me some water? Because I'm fixing to get rushed here. I want to make something real clear, though. I wantto make somethingreal clear. Because the first... I know, I really... I know. Really, Blake. Thanks. That's all thanks. I'll fix the little bastard. I know right? And what's up with this shit? What's up With this over here? We can't No, I can't see him Listen I'm there What's the matter? What's wrong with this? Mark Come on, Bubba It's Rick If they start rushing me From this side, little brother That is down now With that, brother Somebody better have my back I guarantee you All right All right But let me tell you Where I'm coming from here Because the bottom line is And I'm sure Mark and Dave touched on this last night. We were tied up in the airport and couldn't get here, but I'm sure they touched on his business. The truth of the matter is, alcoholics and non, we assume a lot in AA. We assume it because you're sitting in this room that you're an alcoholic. And I, and I'm going to tell you something, folks, that's an assumption that can get you killed because you've got to be careful who you're listening to. Somebody comes in and they start acting like they know what they're talking about around medicine. You assume they're a doctor? No, you're going to check the credentials. But somebody comes in, starts telling you how to work the steps and you assume that they know what they're talking about just because they've got some dry time under their belt. But the long and short of it is they may not even be one of us. Y'all understand that? In order to get sober, what you may need to do is go to the gym and get laid a little bit more. It works for a lot of people. I mean, you know. Only about 15% of us in this world, folks, are alcoholic and addict guys. Only about 15%. That's a big percentage, though. Still, 85% of the people can take this stuff or leave it alone on a requirement for membership. They say short form anyway is a desire not to drink any more on it comes to the door. I don't want to drink today. One day in time. Great. Never even had a problem with alcohol. Never even Had a problem. With a drinking problem, but he comes in and women are goddamn good looking. The coffee is great fellowships. You bar none, but the best in the West. So I'll just stay one day at a time. And kill them by the thousands with their bullshit. And kill him by their thousands for their bullshit, because let me tell you something. Their life doesn't depend on getting connected spiritually. Here's what the book says. Here's where the books. It's going to be the problem section right here. I can see. Come on, girls. For those who are unable to drink moderately, this is on page 34, guys, in a chapter called More About Alcoholism. We're assuming, of course, that the reader desires to stop. Again, which is an assumption Bill Wilson understands. Whether such a person can quit on a non-spiritual basis depends upon the extent to which he has already lost the power to choose whether he will drink or not. You get it? Let me do it one more time. You've got to get this piece because it's always easy. Whether such A person can Quit Upon a Non-Spiritual Basis depends upon the extent to which he has already lost the power to choose whether he will drink or not. You've got a guy who goes out and gets a DWI, comes into the fellowship for a little bit, goes back out, gets another DWI and says, shit, I'm done with the law. I'm going to stay sober. So he walks into the scholarship. The fear of getting another DWi keeps him sober and he stays in the fellowship. And he's welcome. Welcome. But if the cat doesn't have to get connected spiritually to stay over, that's the cat you've got to be careful with what's coming out of his damn mouth because, because if his life doesn't depend on God and he tells a newcomer that they don't have to depend on god, then what do we got? This is why we're not staying sober in the fellowship. We've got a bunch of people believing that they can come into this fellowship and share any damn message they want. It's an individual program. That's not what this book says. This book says precisely how we recovered precisely how we recover. That means that Bill Wilson got sober doing certain things. If y'all are reading his story, what happened, he ended up doing a fifth step with Ebby. He's sitting in Towns Hospital detoxing. He's already making his damned amends when he had his barn-burning spiritual experience. Approximately nine days in treatment. Y'all with us? And then he goes out and gets Dr. Bob. And then Dr. Robb has the same kind of spiritual experience Oh, it's the educational variety. He doesn't see a vision, but the obsession to use is removed from him because he got off his ass and started making his amends. June 10th, that's the birth date of Alcoholics Anonymous. Y'all with us? Two days later they go out and get alcoholic number three supposedly and four and five and six and seven and the rest is history. And let me tell you where my passion comes from. Let me tell You where my emotion comes from is because those people followed some simple directions and got their arrogant ego out of the way. I'm sober today, 13 years. and I couldn't stay sober for years because I kept listening to some son of a bitch that believed that they should be able to share anything they wanted into an AA meeting I think at Denny's they got Denny'S in New York they got Denny''s everywhere don't they I think around this table back over here having coffee you should share everything you want but I think in an AA meet when somebody is walking in the door and you don't know who you're talking to, you better be talking out of this book. You better be giving somebody the clear message. Are you willing to risk their life? Okay, who's risking their life, the people around the fellowship? How many of you guys have heard this? Take your time to work the steps. We didn't get this sick overnight. We're not going to get well overnight. And we could go just, we could take all the little one-liners and have a run at them. I mean, it's the bottom line. You can't, you can't chair any meetings until you've been sober six months. You can' t work with anybody until you've been sober? Jesus. Unbelievable. Who came up with this shit? Who came up with this crap? Because that's the rehab... Come on, baby. Come on. Come on baby. And let the record show that Chris Raymer was not the one that said that. But it is the absolute truth. It is the absolutely truth. A bunch of well-meaning people who figured they could make a buck out of this business got hold of this simple message that we were using for 66 years and now, are you with me? And now, no telling what you might hear. And this is where everybody wants to split hairs with me. Chris, you're knocking rehab. I'm not knocking rehab Rehab's a wonderful thing. It's the same thing when I'm talking about therapy. Therapy's a Wonderful Thing. But therapy will not remove the obsession to drink. No human power can remove the obsession to drink. The ABCs in the book were put there for a specific... You think Bill Wilson was just having a bad day when he wrote that stuff? He got pretty energetic about this business. He said, you can depend on everyone. I mean, if you can get sober for a woman, you're an 85%er. You're not one of us. If you can gets over for a job, you are not one us. If you could work through your issues around this, that and the other and come out the other side and the obsession, if you could control it and go on, you aren't one of use. Do you all understand that? but we've watered the whole fellowship down so that everybody can get comfortable and happy. But you see, we're not here for that. We're here to help the chronic alcoholic whose last hope is a reliance and dependence in a relationship with God. Absolutely. And it's not about a belief in God. I know. They say you can make a lot of money in the Baptist church. Hell, what am I doing here with you losers? Because this is the only thing I can get excited about. Alcohol, I mean, I don't know. You know, I do not know. Let me test some of you all are big book thumpers and a lot of you have got some knowledge about the big books so do not get me if I am not exactly clear on every little date in you. But when Ebi came and talked to... I am starting to speak in tongues already. When Ebi... Let me run something by you. If an alcoholic is somebody who has lost the power to choose and control his alcohol, that the book talks about, y'all with me? On page 21 it says, and it talks for the next 20 pages about the mental obsession. If you can put alcohol in your body and guarantee me how much you're going to drink every time, you with me, you're not one of us. But if there's times that it gets away from you and you drink a bit more, we used to laugh about it. I just drank quicker than most. I was fast. Okay, if you've ever drank a bit More Than You Intended, you have the physical allergy. Okay? I'm sure they talked about this last night. Now, the mental obsession piece is the piece that gets us. If given sufficient reason, those two DWIs, that screaming match with that wife, whatever, compromise health, If any of that becomes operative, if you can stop and stay stopped, then you're not one of us. You with me? Okay. So this is what alcoholism is about. It's about these two words right here, guys, control and choice. You with Me? So when we go into that meeting next week, and y'all take me back over to New York someplace and we go in to a nice little meeting and some little lady's crying her eyes out because the frigging babysitter didn't show up on time and she was running late and she Was just having a terrible day and I've got to run in her hose and the guy's back over there and he can't find a job and then we all sit around and smile and oh yes and we try to be patient and tolerant and yeah and everybody's watching the clock because they can't wait to get out of there because there's absolutely no power in this meeting what we've got ourselves into is another bitch session another complaining session we've been delivered from the obsession to drink got the greatest miracle going on in our lives but we can't do we can find anything good to talk about all we can do is bitch about something else y'all with me? and we sit there and tolerate it we sit there's a lady She wrote an article in Box 459 one time, and one day, and she's supposedly from New York. I'm going to find this lady and hug her. I don't know. She had 15 years of sobriety. I've talked about it on every tape I've ever done. She had about 15 years sobrietry when she wrote the article. And she said in this, she says, at what point does live and let live become apathy? At what point is life and let life become apathies? At what point am I going to sit there and listen to you piss and moan again and again and again in a meeting and turn my back in the guise of patience and tolerance? When am I gonna turn to you and say, hey, buddy, why don't you and me step outside after the meeting and finish this conversation? But right now, there's some people that have had spiritual experiences in this room that would like to share their hope with a newcomer. You want me to paraphrase it? Why don't you shut up? And you see, I say this on the podium. I'm not expecting you to go into your meeting and somebody gets off and says, Hey, shut up! You know what I mean? And that's what a lot of y'all do. And you think... Guys, I lost this eye in a rock fight, not in an AA meeting. I mean, we cease fighting anything or anyone. It's a ten-step promise. Your job is not to go in an EA meeting and pick fights. I'm not suggesting that you do that. I'm saying as a group, we need to look at our group conscience and we needto look and see what we're doing in our meetings. Open discussion meetings, outnumbered literature-based meetings, about six to one. You can go to Dallas, Texas right now and there's an area, there's about 1,500 meetings a week in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. Only 25 of those are literature- based meetings. Can y'all get down with this? That's why nobody can get sober. If you want to talk about the fucking divorce one more time, you've got a bunch of choices, you see. But if you wantto go read about the solution, you've got to hunt and pick. You see? And that's the problem. And this is exactly what my sister back here was saying. It's the treatment centers that have gotten in the middle of this. If you're having a bad day, you need to go share it. You need to talk about it. Why? I mean, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. But really, can we get serious? Why do you need to go shared? Selfishness and self-centeredness that they covered so beautifully today as the root of my problem. What I need to do is get out of myself and try to help somebody else have a better day. And you want me to go to a meeting and just talk about my shit some more? Why don't you just hand me a lit cigarette and dump me with gas? Here, buddy, smoke this. This will help. Isn't it the truth? All right, let me ask you a question. Did anybody hear me say that you shouldn't talk about your problems? You need to talk about your problems. But why don't you talk about the problem? It's exactly what Dave said this afternoon. Why don'tyou look around the fellowship and find somebody who has had some similar problems and then after the meeting, y'all go to dinner and talk about that. You see, there's two different things going on here. There's the fellowship over here and there's the program over here. In the fellowship, look at the knowledge and the experience that I could glean from this room about anything I ever wanted to know. I mean, truly. I mean some of it, some pretty sick shit, I'm sure. But, you know, I am sure a few of you crack addicts lived in these rooms too, didn't you? Yeah, yeah. I had you pegged right off the bat. I know, really. No, come on guys. Of course we can do that. But in a meeting, we have one message. Our fifth tradition says we have One Primary Purpose And that's to help the alcoholic get sober, folks. And if you're talking about the divorce, then you're missing the point because if she's drinking over the divorce She ain't one of us We're we're buying into it. We're feeding into here's here's the picture We're painting now guys This is why some of you are feeling uncomfortable including myself because i'm going to tell you i've done it I did it for years walk into a meeting dump my problems, right? Expect y'all to fix it and then walk out and wonder why I couldn't stay sober Y'all understand that? We're painting a picture for the world out there that if I can work with you and keep you in a place where you don't have any highs or any lows and that all your problems will be taken care of, that you can stay sober. Guys, ladies, please, all of y'all play with me if you would, please. You don't Have to if you don' t want to, but raise your hand at this. Raise your hand if you drank when you had lots of money. Is that the record show ever handing up places? How many when you didn' t have any money? How many of you lived in a big, beautiful place like New York City? How many when you're in a little stupid place like Ingram, Texas? How many were you living in a $300,000 home? A double wide. That's shit. Leave them up. Just leave the hands up. Here's the kicker. How many are you in a relationship with somebody that... An angel. A tremendous relationship with someone. How many where you're dating Satan? So why is it that we... We talked about it earlier. It's like Fred does in the stories in the 23 to 43. Fred says, the best line in the book, it was the end of a perfect day, not a cloud on the horizon. What does this son of a bitch do? He goes and gets drunk. It's so perfect, I'll just go screw it up. And every one of us in here have done it. Why? Because we have lost the ability to choose whether we're going to do it or not. My circumstances are not a prerequisite for whether I'm going to drink or not. So why have we turned our meetings into a damn therapy session where all we talk about is our circumstances? Let's talk about the message. Let's talking about the power. Let's talked about God. You with us? I'll move on. I got a few minutes with you because I've got to get this out. I'm fixing to choke. thank you for listening