Step 2 and Coming to Believe – Step Workshop – Part 2 of 2 – Ralph S.

alcoholic if we're going to get through these steps one of us is going to have to start and obviously it's going to be me no i'll tell you ralph did call me just a few minutes ago and last week he went first so he nominated me this week but i i thought he was going to give a little more of a personal introduction uh i've given him a host of very kind things to say about me before handing it off but uh i'll just say those myself over the course of this hour but uh i am thrilled to be back with you guys tonight and uh uh ali and theresa and everybody that's working so hard to put this on thank you so much and thank you for inviting ralph and i and we had a great time last week and uh and i've looked around and a lot of the people at least some of the people that were here last week are back which is always kind of a good sign you know we don't have to turn over the whole crowd every week so thank you for coming back even if your sponsors made you do it and uh but we are you know we i'll have to say that i look around there's what 333 of us on here right now and i scrolled around before the meeting and it's just for me to think that that the number of people on this meeting that i know and know well that are from all over the country it's just heartwarming to be able to visit like this and those of you that i haven't met personally i'm i'm grateful to have for us all to be together uh you know we're i said last week and as we talk about these steps and and and we should not confuse the conversation for the application of these steps what we're having is a conversation and uh and it it will be hopefully fun hopefully interesting but as i said last week it will not be transforming unless i take the information that we talk about and put it into application and so we're talking not walking tonight but I will share often as I said last week during the course of our time about my point of view and what I mean by that is what I'm sharing with you isn't the answer it is not it is an approach it is my relationship to these steps and my relationship to the information and different people will have a different point of vue perhaps And I think there's room for that. In fact, I think that then I'm enriched by hearing the varieties of experiences we've all had with the steps. But last week we ended that first step and as we sort of joked, it was our goal last week to leave you helpless and hopeless. It's sad that you had to stay in that condition a whole week before coming back. But we wanted to, That first step is landing in this helpless, hopeless condition. You know, the first step is a critically important, necessary place to get, but it is a terrible place to stay. It is a horrible place to learn about the problem and now just be stuck in the problem. And the second step, I believe, is at its simplest form a description of the solution to the problem that we talked about last week if I have alcoholism it says that the solution that Alcoholics Anonymous offers me is a power greater than myself which will solve my problem that's what AA offers there may be other things out there that one might choose to do about here's a her alcoholism. I don't have an opinion. Well, I do have some opinions about those, but AA doesn't have an opinion and they're unnecessary for what we're doing because we're in AA tonight. We are coming at this from an Alcoholics Anonymous perspective. So I want to know what AA says about the problem and I want to know What AA says About the solution and then see if I'm willing to avail myself of that solution. But I want to turn to page 43 in our book and read the last paragraph that says, once more, the alcoholic at certain times has no effective mental defense against the first drink. Except in a few rare cases, neither he nor any other human being can provide such a defense his defense must come from a higher power now you know that paragraph starts with once more so what that lets me know is is uh bill and the authors of the book have been telling me over and over and in a variety of different ways helping helping me giving me illustrations and descriptions of alcoholism to decide whether i have it and then it says once more just to be clear steve if you've got this no human power is going to be able to solve your problem that's the way i arrive at the second step and so when we turn the page and go to page 44 it says that you know it says in appreciating chapters we hope we've made clear the distinction between the alcoholic and the non-alcoholic so clearly that's what they've been trying to do is let me know what is the distinction what what is distinctive about me as an alcoholic that is not true of the non alcohol one of the things we looked at last week is when bill talks about uh in the book and it says the classification of alcoholics is in many ways outside the scope of our book but then bill like us he says it's outside the scope of my book and then he classifies a few you know and which is just like us right i don't have to know anything about the topic to speak at on it for great length uh so bill says you know he talks about the manic depressive he talks about to the person that's like other people in every respect except the effect alcohol has on me talks about uh the person who after my drinking for a while thinks that he can drink with impunity it describes these various personality types but he said all these and many others have one symptom in common that sets them apart as a distinct entity so one thing that is distinctive about the alcoholic in the non-alcoholic it says is the phenomenon of craving the allergy to alcohol and so that's one of the distinctions that sets me apart if i'm alcoholic and so when i look here and i get this simple description of alcoholism you know i was about three weeks sober in a in a treatment facility when i made it whatever level i could make it the the i arrived at a decision that i wanted or needed to stop drinking and i found this description of alcoholism or my relationship to alcohol this is pretty specifically about my relationship to alcohol the line that says when you honestly want to and find you can't stop entirely or if we're drinking you have little control over the amount you take you're probably alcoholic And I finally got where I could see that that was true about me. And there was a moment of relief in that concession, in that realization. You know, and a realization is different than information. A realization is when something becomes real to me, not just something I know but something I feel. But the next line was the darkest day I've ever had in Alcoholics Anonymous. The next line, which says, if so, you may be suffering from an illness which only a spiritual experience can conquer. I thought, oh, damn. I got a problem I can't solve. You got a solution I'm uninterested in. You gota solution I don't think is available to me. you got a solution that i don't think i can access i finally got the problem i finally said i've got it and now i'm unwilling unable close-minded whatever variants i want to put on this did not seem like a solution than i was interested in or or available to me now our book goes on to call that on page 45 it says that lack of power is our dilemma And I'll make, again, a point of view here. It does not say that lack of power is my problem. See, this may be my own thinking, but I don't think lack of power is My Problems. I think my problem is that I don' t know I don''t have power. My problem is I keep trying to exert power I don ''t have to do something I can''t do. My problem is that I act like a guy would act if he had power. And I spent all my time before I got to Alcoholics Anonymous trying to exert power I do not have and did not know I did not have. So it says that I must find the power by which I could live, and it must be a power greater than myself. You know, it says that to one who feels he's atheist or agnostic, this might be a problem, right? So it's whether to die an alcoholic death or live life on a spiritual basis are not easy alternatives to face. That's a dilemma. Somewhere further on in the book, it Says Whether to Accept Spiritual Help or Go On to the Bitter End. That's A Dilemma. A dilemma is a problem with two equally unacceptable solutions. I do not want to die an alcoholic death and I do not want to live life on a spiritual basis at least when I showed up yet so I keep looking for door number three when I first get to alcohol what else could we try but in AA we don't have another set of suggestions but you know I uh and he had me he had me so to live life on a spiritual basis of the oh my god okay I guess it's all meaning that Stephen is frozen this second step came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity and um I'm going to pick up the thread where Steve left off, because I came to you guys October 11th, 1986. And I came from and last week we talked about step one and I came with a solid step one experience. You know, it was a it was an experience that I had. It was a conclusion I draw based on that experience, based on you guys describing to me what alcoholism looked like. I hear a lot of people say I learned in the doctor's opinion tells me I'm out. No, I don't. a doctor's opinion describes alcoholism. I match my experience next to that. I have symptoms. If my mama reads the doctor's Opinion, it doesn't tell her she's alcoholic because she's not so but I read the doctor opinion. I met all the requirements I got to when I take one, I can't control the amount when I honestly don't want to put it in me again and I put it in Me again anyway. So if that be the case, I'm suffering from any illness that only a spiritual experience a counter and i am like steve oh my god now you told me the problem uh alcoholism is physical and mental when i take one i can't control the amount i take but i can stop taking one so that's the problem and then the doctor you give me a solution um spiritual experience you give me the medicine i don't like the way it looked like the medicine taste though i am not one that came in and i came to you guys uh with a heavy dose of religious education i grew up as a kid going to church every sunday morning under duress not of my own but i'm a smart guy, and I'm a make-you-like-me guy. And so I go to Sunday school. I recite, you know, on Easter Sunday. Me and my brothers are the ones you put in front of the church because I got a good memory, you know? And I can recite. And I do, I go through the paces. I sit in the church. I'm from Baptist Church. I often say the Baptist experience, for those who don't know, if you're Catholic, I like to think of that as kind of a sedate church-going experience. You know, the hymns are, you know, it's really old and it's really solemn and it is, you know, and it s a lot of majesty in the church but it's kind of, you know, a quiet, sedate experience. Baptist Church on the other hand is full emotion. There's a part in the proceedings where something going to happen you know they call it the holy spirit comes through with a holy ghost folks get up and they're moved they get up in they and he comes over remember who i am i'm the guy that if ain't my experience you lying about it being yours you you perform it and i saw this performance art i saw the preachers that's performed i said listen to the stories that's fables that's missed uh i like stories but daniel and the lions then Jonah in the whale's belly, you know, David and good stories, but they aren't real. They have no place in the real world. And mama, you better not jump up in here with the rest of these people and embarrass me. That was my feeling. And that was my thought. I said, when I turned 16, you won't have to worry about me darkening the doors of anybody else's church. And I said it and I did it. And a minute, this is the sixties changing turbulent time. I'm at church with a bunch of blue collar people, people from the South. They're not slick like me. They're non-intelligent like me and you need somebody to tell you how to live your life. So this idea of that chapter and if we have some people in here who are new, well, Steve started speaking about the chapter in our big book where our second step where you most firmly get grounded in that second step and that's the chapter we agnostics. That's not how I refer to myself when I got to you guys. When I got you guys, I was the skeptic I was the scoffer, I was the cynic. You name me, the agnostic. I had no problem believing there was a power, but it wasn't one I was trying to access and it wasn'T one I was trying TO have available in my life and it WASN'T one that I was really trying TO HAVE relationship with, you know, but I alcohol, it had its way with me. And for anybody that struggles with that, here'S my experience. I'm going to talk a little bit about my experience with this step. The second step came to believe that a power greater than me could restore me to sanity, because when I got to you guys, I already had a power greater than me. So there were some things that were very easy for me in this chapter we agnostics. I had a powerful greater than me already. I called it King alcohol. I was done. Drugs and alcohol had its way with me. So that gorilla, I needed a power greater than it. Needed a power great than it I had done what I like to call the negative second step. I had come to believe in the hopelessness and futility of life as I have been living it. I had coming to believe that they stopped having Christmas. I had to come to believe that I will be walking the streets about 1130 or 12 o'clock. You know, you'll find me walking the street. You'll find we walk in the block. I never been in the military, but I was walking a grid as if I were a sentry. I was walking like a full radius, you know? And I had come to believe that tomorrow is going to look like yesterday, which looks just like today. I had came to believe that I would not have a key to anybody else's door anytime soon. I had comes to believe that the dreams and goals and hopes and aspirations I have for my life, I had achieved some of them and i lost them under the last alcohol i have been working in management in a major utility company in the law department in 1984 you know um and in 1985 i got let go of that job you know and it had been my dream job you guys i wasn't working an hourly salary anymore you know i was working you know I was in a salary position I had 80 people working up under me but I'm the real one what the book describes as the real dr jekyll and mr high as i was growing in the workplace my alcoholism was growing too and the dynamic of dr jacqueline mr high you know i'm vampire by night and i'm businessman by day and the vampire always outgrows the business man and so even in the vampire eventually started coming to work and the vampires don't work at work you know and they call a vampire in one day and say you got to go take dude with you i'm on my dream job and guys like me don't get second chances and so i landed on your doorstep beat up in that condition in just the right condition to approach the second step you know i didn't have no fight up in me and i'm i'm an arguing guy i'm a last word guy i don't you know and i don t really know how to argue i don' t know how t discuss because i don''t argue to try to listen i don don't argue to discuss. You know, I argue and I argue to wait for the pause, you know, because I'm just waiting for the part for me to jump in. I don't know how to do that. And so, but I didn't have no fight, you guys. I wasn't coming in here discussing, you now, why it is that you do this, but I came in just in that condition. And, so, when I was approached by the person in whom the problem had been solved and approached with this second step, and the way I was approach with it, you guys was formally in a big book workshop with a group of people. And it went through that first step like Steve and I went through it last week. And then I'm going to just talk to you guys about my journey to relationship. And It's the most important. Last week, somebody asked us in the Q and A. Over the years, and I've been with you guys 34 years now, he asked over the years what is broad about your first step? And I didn't try to be cheeky but I thought about it all week. You know what? And probably nothing for me. I have a deeper understanding, deeper appreciation but I don't need, you know, I don' t need a better understanding of a whooped ass. I just need to work fast. I don't need a better understanding of what it is. You know, when the book talks about broadening it, it says for if the alcoholic fails to enlarge and perfect his spiritual life, what's my solution? You know if I'm suffering from an illness that only a spiritual experience will solve. So it talks about enlarging and perfecting spiritually. And that's what I've been doing for the last period of time that I've with you guys i spent a lot of time on that i don't you know uh i would imagine if you were a cancer patient you could spend a lot of time laying in the bed reading up on cancer what causes can and all of and it there are cancer patients who do that who do it you know and then there are cancerpatients who don't do nothing but take the therapy take the chemo give me the radiation i really don't need to know how the cells a metabolite i don't really even know if it helps maybe because it helps me to go forth and i'm that guy you know i i have not well i'm lying because i'm a head guy so i still do a lot of study and everything but uh but i uh this business of the second step you guys oh my god this business at a second step um uh over the years I've wavered I think. I've gone up and down. Last night, I heard my sponsor speaking and my sponsor is Bob B out of St. Paul, Minnesota. And he talked about he hit a point in his recovery where he had lost his second step and it made me go back into myself and think about over the years have i lost my second step you know and and so i guess to talk about that i better talk about establishing this relationship a kid who grew up in baptist church who vowed that he would never did self-sufficiency i'm slick and i'm cool if i don't have an answer that answer ain't to be had i come from that place but i i come from being beat down by alcoholism so i started going to meetings and the chapter if if anybody is new on the on the uh call tonight our chapter we agnostics i like to call that chapter i was doing some working a few years back uh in the insurance business and and we were building teams and we have these team building exercises And when you go out and sell a product, it's probably a lot of salespeople here. And anybody that goes selling product in anybody's house, you can call on a business. You can call them, you know, whatever it is. You know, there was a class we took, and this class was called Overcoming Objections. And the chapter we agnostic has to do with, I like to think of it as overcoming objections. I'm not capable of faith. I'm now built like that. My granddaddy, he's built like that. If only I could believe like he believes. In this chapter, it talks about why it makes more sense to believe than not to believe. I grew up in religion. Check this out. This ain't what it said, but this is what I heard. I heard in religion that you have to already believe a certain way. You have to adopt certain attitudes and philosophies, and you have to already believe before you get results. In Alcoholics Anonymous, we don't say that. You ain't got to believe in order to get... Do I now believe or am I even willing to believe in the possible existence of a power bigger than me? You can start from just that beginning because I came in, I told you skeptic, scoffer, cynic, but ass whooped alcoholic. So here's the power of going to meetings, you guys. When I would go to meetings and I would listen, I'm not a dummy. I'm hard-headed. I'm stubborn and American, but I'm not stupid. So how could this many people? Here's the deal. I started going to meetings and I started listening to you guys. And if you go in court and a lot of you guys are familiar with going in court, you know, if you're going court and if most of us have been on the wrong side of the docket, it's a couple of lawyers in here. They've been onthe wrong side of the docket too though. But, you know if you going court there are a couple of things that are persuasive. And the things that a persuasive in a court hearing and in a trial, it's the evidence, right? And the evidence can come in a couple ways. One is documentary evidence. That's his picture. Yes, that's his handwriting. Yeah, that says fingerprint. I see that documentary evidence but the most powerful witness testimony. Witness testimony. And one of the things you guys, one of their most important features for continuing to go to meetings, continue if you knew and if you owe. Every time I go to, I get the witness testimony. I get to witness, I'm teetering, I'm tethering over do I now believe or am I even willing to believe? Book has some really good stuff for me and it says in church it used to say, Ralph, you should believe in this power because if you don't, you're gonna go to hell. It's virtuous to believe. It is not virtuous, something's wrong with you if you believe, you know it. But in the chapter, the agnostics, for all of the ones who think you're on the fence of being an atheist or agnostic and you really cannot get this deal, you know, in that chapter, check this out, you guys. It talks about why it makes more sense to believe than not to believe. I'm going to share with you from me, a guy that's read that chapter. But more importantly, a guide that lives it in his life. It makes more since for me to believe in that. But sometimes I get in my car right now and I'll be driving. And it'll come over me. What if you've been lying to yourself all these years? What have you been wrong about this guy idea? What if it is all BS? What if we drank the egg Kool-Aid? What if that's all again? So what? And my next answer to Ralph talking to Ralph is this it's more comforting for me to believe than not to believe I'm going to pull the curtain away from Ralph Weiss thinking it ain't the virtue, it ain'T reading it in the book well the books say you got enough it's much more comforting to me to be able to to believe than not to believe I couldn't get up in the morning sometime if I thought that there ain't a power because this is what has happened to me as a result of tapping into that power when it talks about overcoming objections what are some of the common objections for a guy like me you know i i gotta see it i ain't capable of faith i ainít capable of believing something i don't see that's for the rest of you guys why would you believe in something like that you know what it's not sensible it's not logical in the book when it talks about overcoming objections how many of y'all been in love before how many y' all moved in with okay ladies how many are y'al moved in with the bad boy you know what does that have what's good what how does any of that what does any of them have to do with pure reason pure logic you know people what are you what what are you really really really faithful to since you said you telling me Ralph you ain't got capacity for faith you faithful to the God or your own reason I'll change you I'll fix it I'll put some of this on him and he gonna get some get right act right he gonna give with me no that and then this is the one that's going to fix me, make me be everything I want. Six months later, I'm wondering how the hell do I get up out of this? So what are those loves? The book talks about those loves. I'm capable of worship. I'M capable of faith. I' m capable of love. And what does any of that have to do with reason at the end of the day? But I'll say, oh, I'm reasonable. I'm a reason. And then I'm one of these guys. No, no, no. You know, you got to show me I'm not down with that. But I claim that, no, I'm not open-minded on that. I'm not trying to be, but I come from the 60s and the 70s. You know what? One of the anthems in the 70, I'll try anything once. Well, why won't you try the God idea on, Mr. I'll Try Anything Once? Why won't you try the god idea on? It depends on how bad you have what it is that I want. I wanted to get whatever was peyote. I ain't never tried that i would love to but you guys i'm you know and then this is me i'm an in control guy i'm a cool guy i'm gonna swap it i'm not an out of control guy i saw people taking some stuff way back in the 70s pcp running around but neck i don't want to be butt naked running around did i try yes i did no one ever so wait a minute dude what is this closed-minded you have the ability You'd be open-minded on any. So I started getting open-mindered to that idea. Be quick to see where religious people are right. L063992, because I scoffed at religious people. You need somebody to tell you how to live your life. You ain't slick as me. You ain'T sharp as me I just said something, L063992. It's some gray-headed people on here like me. And all of us who have gray hair, we remember when phone numbers had letter prefixes. L063992. That was my grandparents' phone number. For as long as I lived, they had one phone number, 1726 East 107th Street. They had one address. My grandmom and granddaddy were married 56 years, and my granddad was my guy. But I used to scoff at granddad. I used to say to myself, why would you want to be with one woman 56 years? Now, I admired and he was a man of integrity. And I wanted to be a man of integrity, I didn't want to do what men of integrity do. He was a men of his word but I wasn't a keeping my word kind of guy. My granddaddy was a blue collar guy and I remember thinking to myself when I was at the height in my work experience, when I'm at the hight of when I thought I'm balling someone, you know I made more in a few years than granddaddie made in his whole career. And it hit me like ton of bricks when the granddaddy ever asked you for bail money be quick to see where religious people are right they have been exhibiting a degree of stability usefulness and happiness that you should have been looking for for yourself one address one phone number stability useful useful when times got hard my mama was my mom was on welfare when we were kids you guys My mom was only raising six. I could walk up the street to grandpa and granddaddies, no education, none of slick. Their answer to every situation, got to see you through, got to make a way. And I'm going to tell you something. I started, these objections started getting overcome, but I can't see the power. I can feel the power, I can touch the power how many of you guys can see electricity? how many of you guys believe you have electricity on at your house right now everybody that's on one of these computer monitors outside of the ones on the phone everybody on here believes they're only like their electricity is on in their house right why do you believe it somebody will say because you can see you can't see the electricity can't See the electricity but we can see the results the lights are on lights are wrong. And every time I go to a meeting and they say, how many people in here have a year sober and hands go up or five years? So that's the lights. I don't see God, but I see the results of it. And I'm not stupid. That many people can't be wrong because we keep going to meetings, you guys, and you guys keep doing one thing that you do consistently. Jeff will get up to the meeting and he'll say, my name is Jeff. Alcohol had its way with me. I found a power greater than myself, I haven't had a drink in 90 days. Andrew will get up and say alcohol had its way with me. I found a power greater than myself, and I haven'T had a drinking two years. Kelly will get up and says alcohol had his way with B. I found the power bigger than me. I haven' T had a drinking six months. That many of you guys can't be wrong. And then it starts getting broader it starts getting deeper for a guy like me when i start seeing the power of the power in my own life it has been revealed to me you know because and uh i always like to say um before i even got to the chapter we agnostics before i ever got to the big reading the book something happened to me on october the 11th of 1986. it happened to me before i hit a meeting and it happened to me before i took a step and it happened to me before i was introduced to the big book alcoholics anonymous and it happen to you before you took a step before you hit a meeting and before you got a sponsor whatever that take the taste out my mouth the thing was whenever that wave stopping moment was that stood between me and that next one and it stayed between me and that from that day to this most of us call that we call that grace we call it that grace and we don't create the grace and we don' produce the grace, and we can't control the grace. We don't predict the grace what I said we catch it we catch you that second step experience and you guys make it attractive and you make it appealing and so I get him but so that that that grace catching experience expand on that that's what we spend the rest of our time doing. And in that second step, what has happened for me as a result of this, it's more than just a conception of a power. What really is the deal is relationship. Relationship. Why do I need relationship with this power? And what does that look like in my life? I'm going to just share a couple of bullet points and I'm gonna throw it back to Steve. You know, what does it look like in my life since I've walked hand in hand with this power? You know because relationship is different than understanding There's a lot of married people on here I would call jimmy and marybeth out if I was sitting here two of my favorite people And relationship ain't got a whole lot to do with understanding your pop your mate just knowing it You gotta understand them. It's some shit. I'll never understand. Really that you like that. I like But I know you I know you, and I'm with you anyway. I know you, and I am with you for you. Not trying to understand you, trying to get in relationship. And so a lot of times people try to do a lot of this deal. If God is small enough for me to understand, he ain't going to be big enough for me to trust. One of my favorite people when we talk about this deal, this second step deal, this second step experience, this second on my whole recovery stands on that three through 12 to 10 step program action to give legs to that second step second step is the it's the solution and as a result of having this second step experience you guys as a reso every time i go to meetings i keep on getting the witness testimony and it drives me even further and deeper in the relationship because when i go to a meeting somebody will stand up at a meeting that's going through something right now And they'll say, I don't see no way out. I don' t see. Right now, one of the powers of sponsorship, you know, it always keeps me in the second step, you guys. Right now. You know, I'm kind of cool personally, you know, for now. Oh, but it's subspensees that's got a lot going on. And I just stay tuned. I love to walk through the journey. I love the walkthrough because, you know, as a result of having this power, what I've discovered, you guys, about this power. He ain't predictable, but he ain't unpredictable. God is not predictable. You could be wallowing in something right now and tomorrow something change. You don't even know when you one step from turning the corner, man. when I was down at my lowest low, when I was down in my lowest law. You don't know when you're getting ready to walk right out. He's not predictable but he ain't unpredictable. God ain't wishy-washy like me. God ain'T some timey like me. God ainT up and down mercurial bipolar like me God is very predictable in the sense of he don't do nothing but keep sending grace. He don't do nothing but take care of his bull. He don't do nothing, but God is love. This old timer told me that one time, you know, that's what he do. You know, that's What he doing right straight with crooked lines. He's predictable in the sense of, you Know, he don't trip when I trip on him. He don' trip when i sit in the car, dude, what part of the game is this? What is this bullshit you putting on my plate? I'm not trying to be doing he don' trip off that when my daughter come to me like that. Daddy, I can't stand you. I'd be like, you know what? I'm trying to help you. You go on, do what you're... God, don't do me like that. But he's not predictable. You guys hear what I'm saying? He ain't unpredictable because we can rely and trust, but he's, he's not predictable if you sitting in something right now. That's why I keep going back to me because I'll hear you talking about it three weeks ago and then you'll come into meeting and you'll have a gleam and you'll be on the other side of it. I'm with some people right now. And sometimes the other site, it's more than a week or two. Oh, but this business of power, of walking with purpose, living with intention as a result of putting my hands in the hands this power as a result of you guys that that last sentence uh steve i'm going to you know it says you know there's a part in we agnostics that summarizes what what what what it is i get to in that second step either god is everything or he is nothing what was my choice to be and i used to do a lot of parsing and talking and doing and room what does that mean and what does this say it's real clear what's my joy i choose god When my heart's broke, I choose God. When they took my heart, I chose God. When it looked like either this hand is heavy, I choose god. When me and my wife broke up and my daughter was getting out the car and going to stay with her godparent and I felt like a failure at 22 years, I choose got. When I put my hand in his hand, you know, 34 years ago, i've i've powdered like i do i've soaked i've cussed i've raged but i ain't snatched my hand out i snatch it out you guys i would like to share with you the experience of snatching that i'm putting back in no i wouldn't like to but i don't have to you know i share my experience now people have that experience but i snatch mine up and i have not regretted it um Steve to go because you know I'll take all the rest of your time. You know, I don't know if you've had an experience though, because as I was talking about our listener sponsor last night, have you had an experienced in your in all your years? Do you have an experience where you felt like you've lost your second step? Repeat it, Ralph. I'm sorry. Have you in all your years sober? I was listening to my sponsor last night. You've heard him often share that at eight years over felt like he had lost his second step. Do you feel as if in your time in recovery, you've ever lost your second step? And what did that look like if so? Well, I absolutely have. And I would say that honestly, I can, you know, I don't know that I've lost the second step, Ralph. I have, I don't know that my belief has waned, but my commitment to the belief has waned. And often unknowingly if I'm not doing that self-examination but when fear takes over when I become subject to my thoughts and my feelings rather than the principles then I am not trusting the God and I think the interesting thing for me and again my experience of the second step is I did not gain trust in the second step. For me, I became open minded and I'm very much from that camp of it being an evolution. And and a spiritual experience of The educational variety. I'm so glad to be back with you guys. I mean, embarrassed. I think my neighbor figured out I've been stealing his internet and cut me off. but I sent my wife over with a $20 bill to get us through the night. And but uh, cause lack of power was my dilemma just a little while ago. And, uh, but, but you know, as I navigate through this thing and, and Ralph talked about it, I think that the, the, the block for me at when I came up on the second step the first time when i'm newly sober and i am uh kind of loving going to alcoholics anonymous i'm loving your company i am comforted by what i'm hearing i'm hearing things that get me excited and make me feel better but i i was resistant to the idea of a power greater than myself and i'm not sure i could even explain the resistance but i was and for the first several months that i was sober and going to meetings i would not hold hands and say the lord's prayer at the end of meetings and i'm grateful by the way that that you gave me room for that in alcoholics and honors that i'm free to do that or not do that and i didn't and uh and a guy came up to me one night and he said steve what's what's keeping you from doing that. And I was being very honest, sincere, but kind of self-important. But I said, you know, I don't want to be a hypocrite because I don' t know what I believe and I'm not willing to just hold hands and sing Kumbaya with the rest of the campers because that's what you guys are doing. And this guy had heard a little bit of my story. He had heard about infidelities in my marriage he had heard about head-on collisions going the wrong way down the interstate he had heard about stealing time and money from a family business he had hurt that I was drunk at the hospital when my daughter was born he said but hypocrisy that's where you draw the line he said that's uh that's really impressive man he said I got good news for you and bad news for you, Steve, because I'm stuck, right? And I'm stuck because I got a problem I can't solve. But but I don't feel like this solution is something I'm going to grab hold of. And he said, I've got good news and bad news for you. And I said, You know, I'll play what's the bad news? He said, The bad news is as being a hypocrite is way down your list of problems. And you might have to address them in the order in which they will kill your has. And I said, What's the good news? And he said, The good things is there's room for another hypocrite and alcoholics anonymous. And see, I'm as grateful for that tonight as I was then maybe more so. I am grateful that I don't have to be perfect to be here that my belief does not have to be perfect that my adherence to these principles is going to come nowhere near being perfect. But am I willing to just be open-minded to the prospect that there might be something other than me? The book says that our human resources as marshaled by the will failed utterly. It doesn't say that I'm not very good at this. It says I'm an utter failure, marshaling all of my human resources all of my good intentions and firm resolve and best efforts to do better failed miserably so if I am truly out of options what am I open to what am i willing to begin to be willing to believe and so that turns me away from that had me I began to hold hands and say a prayer you know Ralph talked about that open mindedness. And I went through that same experience. I'm the most open minded guy you ever met before I got to Alcoholics Anonymous. I'll go to a neighborhood I've never been to, I'd knock on the door of a perfect stranger, I give him a large sum of money for lab tested product. I'd say what's this going to do? I said, Am I going to get ready to take a nap? Are we getting ready to go somewhere? And, and he'd tell me what it's going to do? And I said, Okay, I'll try that and I'll take it. And they get to Alcoholics Anonymous. And I'm looking for the effect right I drank because I like the effect produced by alcohol. I get to alcoholics anonymous and you begin to talk to me about the effect produce by developing and accessing this power greater than myself. I'll Take any street drug, drink any moonshine go anywhere do anything i get here you guys say them say well steve how about saying a prayer in the morning at night i go bullshit that's where i draw the line i'll try everything else but not that and so how about if i'm just be willing to do what you said works for you even if i don't believe it now what happens and and the second step is merely i believe as the book says my being willing to be willing to believe. And the third step will be my commitment to take the actions that support that belief. And, you know, in the second step, you know, we've got now 377 people here, I see eight people logged off when I went mute on this thing. I'm sorry that we lost. But uh, that this thing went, you know, there's there's 376 now just offended one more person 376 people on here, please hang on with me. And amongst this broad group of people, there is a wide variety of beliefs and see our book says, this chapter we agnostics gives me so much room, so much room to find a conception and an angle of approach to this power that works for me and i didn't see that initially it took someone else helping me see and over years i see it more and more like god does not make too tough terms on those who honestly seek him it says each of us that amongst this group of now 375 people my god they're jumping off like like the ship is thinking that uh that of this 374 people on here that this that that there's a wide variation in the way each of us approaches and conceives of that power and it says for our purposes these differences need not matter because our purpose when we gather together is to stay sober and help other alcoholics achieve sobriety and see part of my resistance to everything was i would not say the word god for the first two years i was sober because i wouldn't say the word god because i didn't want you to think i meant what i thought you meant when you said god and the truth is i'm totally unconcerned these days with what you mean and i'm comfortable using the name because god is god regardless of what i say about about god there's the story that i that i often use that some of you will have heard about the blind men and the elephant and it says there were three men from hindustan to learning much inclined they went to see an elephant but all of them were blind one of them grabbed the elephant by its tail and one of them grabbed the elephant around its big leg and the other one grabbed the elephant by its trunk and they went back to their village and the others villagers had also never been exposed to an elephant and they said tell us about the elephant tell us abut the elephant and the one who grabbed the elephant by the tail described the elephant as being like a rope and the ones who grabbed the elephant round its big legs described it as being a column and the one who grabbed the elephant by its trunk said it was snake-like and they argued endlessly about what an elephant was never understanding that the elephant could be big enough to encompass all those traits and they weren't describing the elephant they were describing their relationship to the elephant. They were describing their touch point to the elephant and I've come to the belief I have found comfort in Alcoholics Anonymous that that we are just finding a touch point to this power. And I don't have to describe the power. What our book says we do, our book shows that each of us in our own language, from our own point of view, talks about how he established a relationship with God. In AA, we spend our time talking about how we establish the relationship, which is through the process of the 12 steps. The 12 steps are the pathway to the power, they are not the power! We don't have to argue about God. We talk about the actions we take to remove those things that block me off from the sunlight of the spirit, and then I get to have my own relationship with this power, whatever it might be, and danny we endlessly try to articulate a spiritual experience that defies articulation. So I kept fighting about nothing really, and here's the good news. It's, you know, in the 12 and 12 in the second step, it describes the second step as the rallying point. You know? Everyone on here, if we start with a presumption that all 372 of us now have decided that we have alcoholism, and we go, well, what are we going to do about it? Well, somebody suggested we take these other steps. Well, all right, guys, let's meet tomorrow in the parking lot at the mall. We're going to have a rally. We're gonna get together and then we are gonna go together through these steps. And step two is the rallying point. And it says whether believer, non-believer, former believer, atheist, agnostic, We all gather, we rally at the same place and begin this journey through the steps together. And then we have our own experience and we share that with others, whatever that is. I kept thinking something was supposed to happen to me at the second step. But in fact, that second step, and it did, but it was imperceptible to me because what happened was that closed-mindedness was cracked open just a little bit to allow me to continue on in the process of my recovery. But, you know, my sponsor, because I was having a problem with the language. The language prayer made me uncomfortable. The language spiritual experience and spiritual awakening made me comfortable. My sponsor took me back to Appendix 2 where it talks about, you know spiritual experience and um you know our book says three times before i get to page 45 to or 48 to to go back to appendix two in one place it says for amplification please see appendix 2 and then it says you know for uh uh for more information please see a pic you know go to appendix two and then it finally says please hey steve you dumbass please go to appendix 2 we've been telling you go back there take a look and what i saw when i went back there was language that was accessible to me because my sponsor said steve your hung up on language and i want you to have an experience i don't care what you call it a rose by any other name would smell as sweet and see i kept getting caught up in this language and the verbiage and how we're talking about it and this is not about language this is about an experience and it said back there that that i could have a personality change sufficient to bring about recovery and i was willing to have a personal change before i was willing to spiritual experience and it was and the only difference being the language i was attaching to it so what i found as a beginning point in we agnostics is comfort in the following things and uh uh and then we'll give it back to ali and take some questions but it says no one can fully define or comprehend that power which is god so i'm just taking the point of view for me that that none of us can fully just like those three blind men and the elephant. None of us has the whole story. We have our relationship to that power. It says deep within every man, woman, and child is the fundamental idea of God. I've just chosen to take the point of view that God is deep within me and deep within every man woman and child and that has become a comfort to me, a connection point, a common denominator. Now, I've assigned that whether someone else believes that or not, I'm unconcerned by and I don't take it as an affront. That has now connected me to the rest of the human race in a way that I wasn't before. It tells me the things that I have to look out for that will block me off from this power that I must find. The one that will lock me off is pomp, worship of other things and calamity and the way to get rid of pomp worship of other things in calamity is to work the 12 steps because those three things are part of the bondage of self that are holding holding that blocking me off from that power deep within and pump and worship about a pump is just the reemergence of pride and ego worship of Other Things as anything I've decided is is more important than and actually i don't usually decide it's more important it becomes the most important thing in my life when i'm not paying attention all of a sudden a job or relationship or money or some some material thing takes the highest position in my wife and i didn't even see it happen and when that happens i'm blocked off from this panel and calamity you know that was a calamity when when uh when i froze up and fell off a calamities anything i have decided can't be happening to me you know there are i know you guys have some tough times but i hardly ever describe you go through tough times i have a calamite i'm recording a basketball game i want to watch right now if this thing is over and i go in there and that game didn't record that's a freaking calamity now you may be suffering from illness or financial ruin that's a tough time and I'll tell you the third step but Jesus I got a calamity going on over here because this can't be happening to me and I will tell you that I just want to be more and more open to allowing more and more things to happen to me so I'm not blocked off from that power so so we are here tonight ending up at the rallying point we're all going to hope to take the old time in i'm gonna have i'm going to show a modicum of open-mindedness i will come back next week and we will begin to all 365 of us will come by and navigate through these steps next week so thanks