Responsible Sponsorship – Sponsorship Workshop – Part 1 of 2 – Local AA Speakers

This is pretty darn cool. You know, I'm John, a grateful, recovered alcoholic. My sobriety date is September 4th, 1999, and for that I am very, very grateful. And I want to thank each and every one of you. Before we get started, just thank you for being here. And this is pretty impressive. A beautiful Sunday, and everybody's here. That's cool. And I think this exceeded my expectations, and I know Ed was talking about the same thing. And so don't get a big head about it, but you can pat yourself on the behind. And that's really cool because we could have easily come in here and there would be 25 of you. Still would have been great, but it's glad that we're all here. And what we're doing, I mean, it's a responsible sponsorship. That's what we'RE going to talk about today. And, you know, those of you who have paperwork, and I apologize we didn't print more, But let me read what I put as our mission statement here. And it says, to provide the newcomer with the facts about alcoholism and ultimately the program of recovery as detailed in the book Alcoholics Anonymous. To become effective members of our home group and, as a result, effective members of society is the message that I carry improving my effectiveness and the effectiveness of my group. And that, in a nutshell, is kind of why we're here. That's why this group was formed. You know, there's 1,500 other meetings in Dallas. And the co-founder or the founders, the spearhead of this group, you know, they wanted an opportunity to really get in and digest the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. And here we are 22 years later going strong. And I guarantee you they had no idea 22 years ago that a Sunday afternoon would look like this. And this is, I mean, this group and this program has saved my behind. And I'm very, very proud to be here. And like I said earlier, proud of all of y'all for showing up. We're going to cover a whole bunch of ground today. And a lot of this stuff that we're going, like Ed and I are going to, Ed andI are going kind of do a little house cleaning, I guess you could call it, and talk about some important issues that are part of the group and maybe some pitfalls that we've come across. And then Cindy and Dara are going to really focus on our 12-step commitments and what our responsibilities are there and how can we be more effective there. One of the things that we noticed, if this group was only like 40 people and one or two people were dropping the ball or something, it's not that big of an issue, right? But when we're as big as we are and people are dropping theball or, you know, what I'm saying, that potential problem is greatly magnified. And so we just want to all be on the same page and learn how to be effective sponsors and to learn how to be effective members of our group, you know, because we've got people coming to this group from all over the world. And if we're not there to greet them and show them around and show then what the program is all about and do all that stuff, you know ill will can creep up. Do you want to say anything before we get rolling? Yeah, before we go into covering some of these questions, I just hope everybody, and myself included, can keep an open mind that none of us got this thing right. And we've grown by such large numbers that we're experiencing perhaps what any group this size would be experiencing, growing pains in a group that doesn't continue to look at itself. And we'll get into this in just a minute and continue to move forward and grow. Well, you know, surely the � how should I say it? They'll just disappear. We've got so many. And so that's really another reason why we're here is to collectively look at what we could be doing better and perhaps some things we shouldn't be doing that we're doing that kind of gets into some things we'll cover in detail which have to do with traditions and unity. So having said all that, I guess we'll just kind of let John cover some of the questions in here. And I'll say this. If you've got a question, please. I mean, it can kind of be intimidating sometimes or a comment. Just raise your hand and we'll try to take them. But we just beg of you, just like the people who wrote the book did, to keep an open mind and like we do at Group Inventory here, we do some questions we all have to ask ourselves. And with that, I'll kind of kick it back over to John. All right. The bullet number one we have is, do I understand the difference between 12-stepping and sponsorship? Sponsorship, and there is a difference there. My sponsor calls me up and says he's got a wet one at Parkland Hospital or some motel somewhere. That's a 12-step call. There's the 12-stepping. I'm going to go share my experience, strength, and hope. We're going to talk about the things we need to talk About. We're Going to Identify. We're GoING To Do That Stuff. But sponsorship is me, once I've qualified the guy and the guy has admitted he's a real alcoholic and he wants to go through with it, then I take the responsibility of a sponsorship. And it is not me being an effective sponsor. It's not how fast I can get this buckaroo through the steps. You know, let's go through 1 through 12 and now I'm done. My duty is done. That's not sponsorship. That's assembly line, you know. I mean, I don't have a template for taking guys through the steps. We do it as fast as possible, right? But I've got to make sure that they understand these things. And to be a sponsor is to be responsible because, in effect, that guy's life � I mean it's not my job to get him sober. It's not My job to save his life. But I am, in fact, responsible for this young man or whatever his life at that point. Because without AA, the program of Alcoholics Anonymous, this knucklehead is likely to die drunk just like I was. And I'm no different than he was, right? So it's my job to guide them through the material in this book, to take them under my wing, to show them what the programof AlcoholicsAnonymous is, and to hopefully show the effect of these principles in my life through him and to him. And so there's a difference of 12-step work and 12-stepping in sponsorship. You know, you can kind of segue into, you know, do I know how to, the next bullet is, do I Know How to Help the Newcomer Find Their Truth? Well, I mean, in order for me to be an effective sponsor, I have to A, understand the truth about my alcoholism. i have to be properly armed with the facts about myself because i can't transmit something that i haven't got and it's not my job with the newcomer to sit down and and try to say the magic thing that'll get them sober you know what i mean i got to tell them my story i got to ask them some stuff about them we've got to get the identification process going properly armed with the facts about myself, I can explain to them alcoholism as I know it and more importantly as it relates in this book. That is my first deal. You know, it's not there to pat them on the behind and love them into sobriety. It's just to lay out the facts, right? This guy needs to know or in the late, you know, you know the drill if it's a woman but, you know, I don't want to have to keep going back and forth but this guy needs to know what alcoholism is. And then once he knows what alcoholismo is, he needs to know, A, if he is an alcoholic. And if he isn't an alcoholic, he's screwed and I'm going to tell him that. You know? And it's not to shock him or scare him into sobriety. It's like it says in the book, page 132. It says, we have recovered and been given the power to help others. And I can only be recovered and stay recovered if I, A. go through the steps myself B, continue to follow the steps on a day-to-day basis. And C, continue to practice these principles in all of my affairs. And that means out there. You know? Michael always says we can teach a monkey through the steps with flashcards. Anybody can be slick and come in here and say the right thing. But the proof of the pudding is how do we relate to our families? How do we rate to our employers? our potential employers, our people at the halfway house? How do we relate with society at large? And that's all part of the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. Because those are all the things that were very, very problematic for me prior to September of 1999. You know? What is my role as a sponsor? And I kind of covered that, but I'll go over it again. My role as the sponsor involves a whole lot of deals. we might should have named that bullet what is not my role as a sponsor. I'm not your accountant. I'm Not Your Financial Advisor. I'm NOT Your Relationship Therapist. And I'm NOT Your Banker. No, I don't pay your bills. But what is my role? My role is to sit down and identify with the newcomer. Right? And I've always got to remember that that newcomer as tore up as they are is just like I am. Just because I'm here a few years later doesn't mean any different. That guy is just like I was, and I want to treat them the same way that Cliff Bishop treated me. And Cliff Bishop told me the truth. We had the identification. Then Cliff Bishop took me under his wing and took me through the steps as outlined in the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. Right? He told me what to read, where to read it, where to show up. You know? He didn't call me and check up on me. And I look at my sponsor and he's got what he wants. That's cool, and I want that. If I can be a fraction of my sponsor, then it's biscuits and gravy for me. But that's part of my role as a sponsor, to take that new guy and show him what the program says because there's a lot of misinformation and ignorance out there. So we're going to show them what it says. They're goingto do what we do. I'm going to get that guy in the game and show them what it means to be a member of Alcoholics Anonymous. And in practice, these principles, I'm going to show them how we make these amends and then how to repair the damage done in the past. Step 10 is very, very important. I'm not going to tell them how I do step 10 with my sponsors. I'm just going to say, I'm only going to go ahead and tell my guys this is part of the deal. Just because we're sober now and you're out making amends, now we've got to keep the streets clear, right? Step 10 has vitally important. And we're going to hit step 10 a whole bunch, I think, in this deal today. Because from some of the problems that I've seen that have occurred recently, when you get down to the nitty-gritty, Nugglehead B over here ain't talking to his sponsor. Because I'm talking to these sponsors like, did you know anything about that? And they're like, nope. First I've heard it. I'm like, well, wow. You know, I don't call my sponsor and ask him if I can cross the street. I call my sponsor when I'm in fear or resentment. If I'm facing a situation that day, at that moment, that I don't know how to handle. I want his experience. He's been where I'm at and he knows the way out. I don'T go to 50 other members of my group or other groups to ask them what they think. I go to my sponsor. Because believe me, I've got some buddies out there that go to this group. I can get the answer that I want. I can call them. I can give the damn right answer thatI want. It may not be the correct answer, right? And, I mean. I'm just going to let you finish out these notes. Okay. All right. I think I'm going to come back to that one because there's a whole bunch. Is there accountability, ten-step, between me and my sponsor and with the people that I sponsor? Yes and no. Sometimes they're better than others. You know, when I tell my story, I usually always tell this. I know I do when I do the steps. In the years that Cliff's been my sponsor, the biggest butt-shoe I have ever had is 10-step stuff. And the long story short is I've managed to finagle some things my way. Had to do with work, had to do it with family, and I got to get it my way, and I go out of town early on a day's work, and I had it all set up the way that I wanted. And, I mean, work is going sideways. Nothing is going right, And I talked to Kurt, I talked to Myers over the weekend, I talked to my mom, everybody under the sun except my sponsor. My sponsor had heard about it through the grapevine from Kurt and Myers. So I remember I called him that Sunday evening when I returned home and told him what a pitiful weekend I had and he let me share it and he proceeded, you know, it's not like court. What I say can and will be used against me, right? And he just asked me, he said, hey, who's running the show here? Where's God? Who the hell do you think you are? You're an alcoholic. And here you are managing this, doing this, running this show. It's all blowing up. You're letting all this stuff pile up. You're not a normal guy, dude. You're and alcoholic. We let that normal stuff pile off enough. I go drink. And it went on, and it wasn't that nice. It went on and on and On. And I learned a very valuable lesson. My job is when I get into fear, resentment, worry, all that good stuff, I call my sponsor. And even if I don't get my sponsor, sometimes Wednesdays are very hard during the day for me to get in touch with my sponsor Even when I don t get him, I leave him a voicemail. Because see, my actions show God how willing I am not to pick up a drink. Now I can think, I can do some mental gymnastics and hank it through. and I can pray about it and do all that stuff but God wants to see me in action so I pray about it I call my sponsor I get his voicemail I leave him a voicemial and say hey Melanie's not acting right that's never happened maybe once or twice Mel says once Once it is, all right? But no, I call him and I leave that voicemail, right? My sponsor will call me back. Okay, but what I've just demonstrated is A, that I've relied on God, I've said the prayer. B, I'm gone one step further and taken some action as outlined in this program and those actions show God I'm willing to go to any length. All right? That's how we do a 10-step. And that's my responsibility. Oh, my sponsor's too busy. somebody pointed that out to me very early on because I made that comment well you know Cliff sponsors everybody and she said maybe Cliff's having a bad day maybe everybody Cliff Bishop sponsors has twisted off maybe he's having a bad days with his wife maybe he just needs to hear your little stupid voice on the voicemail saying hey Cliff everything's kicking butt so get out of yourself and call your sponsor is what I was told and I do that and rarely does a day go by that I'm not in touch with my sponsor rarely and that way I'm in practice you know what I'm saying that way when my boss doesn't do it right I'm already in the habit of picking up the phone when something bad happens or something good happens I'm always in the process I'm also already in a habit of taking care of it because I'm an alcoholic and left to my own devices that little stuff is going to pile up to where it reaches a point and if it always reaches the point while I still think I'm connected to God but it's been my experience that it reaches that critical point and I ain't connected to God and my mind comes up with drinks and I don't want to drink no more so I try to do my 10 step and I try to share that with the guys that I sponsor you know I love it when they call me like well I should have called you yesterday but I'm like why didn't you call me yesterday Well, I know you've got to go through the same thing. Like Ed said earlier, we're not perfect at this. I'm never going to do a perfect 10-step. I'm not just trying to be perfect, but I'm going to try to apply these principles in my life. Because first and foremost, I don't ever want to pick up another bottle of vodka. Ever. And I will go to any length not to do that. And that is my responsibility. That's not my sponsor's responsibility. It's not Melanie's responsibility to watch over me to see if I'm doing a 10-step. It's my little boy's responsibility. My sobriety is my responsibility. He told me one time, he said, hey, if your sobriery isn't important to me, why in the hell do you think it, you know, to you, why do you feel like it's important to you? Why do you believe it would be important to him? Pretty good point. And I don't chase my guys around. Here's the drill. Here's what we do. Your sobriety is your responsibility. How am I doing practicing these principles in all my affairs? Method AA, homework, et cetera. Again, here's where 10-step comes involved and 11-step. How am i practice these principles out there? I mean, I always hate the story of the guy, you know, getting up from the podium somewhere, some mythical podium somewhere and say, well, I had a crappy day, beat the wife, hit the dog, da-da-da, but I didn't take a drink today, I'm a complete success. Wrong. I know how to do that, all that stuff. I don't want to be that John Kelly. So I've got to plug this program and call it. See, this program answers all my problems. So I got to take this program with me wherever I go. And the more, the better I do at that and the more I do that I'll see that my workplace, my work environment, My work relationships, they prosper. My friendships prosper. My family relationships prosper. My relations with my wife prosper. That's all a part of... I remember early on, before I had a relationship, before I'm living by myself in Oak Cliff, and people would talk about that, and I'm thinking, why are they making such a big deal about... Sober is easy, right? Wait until you get a relationship. Because they don't always do it my way. You know, and it's like, how do I do? How do we react? And so now I've got to put these principles into my life. And it seems to me that if I'm really diligent at trying to apply these things, my life just kind of clicks along. You dig? I mean, it's kind of smooth. Yeah, there's ups and downs, hills and valleys, but nothing is out of control. It's when I start repeatedly butting my head against the wall You know, that relationship is on and off and crazy and this and work is crazy and this. And then that's me usually running the show. And where I get in trouble is when I'm doing God's will and he don't know anything about it. And Cliff also told me, and I had to learn this the hard way. I traded futures options by myself. By myself. It was like going to Vegas every day. And I did that for a couple of years. And I always paid my bills. And then I got into a relationship. Now, that's kind of scary when you're in a committed relationship where, you know, May the 30th, I'm hoping for a big day in the S&P so I can pay rent. You know? That's kindof a lot. And I didn't want to put that away. And we went round and round and around. He never told me to put it away. He just told me this. He says, hey, if it's God willed, that'd go down like sweet butter. He goes, I'm not telling you not to do it. But maybe it's not your time to do it now. And I wanted the relationship with Melanie more than I wanted to sit in front of a stinking computer all day. And maybe one day I'll be able to do that. But I got to put that away, no second thought, and I got the opportunity to do what I wanted. To be with the love of my life. That's how we learn to practice these principles. Because there's been a whole bunch of stuff the old man has told me through the years that I thought he was absolutely nuts. Absolutely crazy. And I prayed about it, and I followed his directions the best I could. And every time I walked through that and got through that and realized, you know what? The SOB was right again. And I told him, he's on a short leash with me. As soon as he screws up, he is done. I'm getting out of here. I told them the other day his trial membership with me was running out, I think I'm going to renew. And then here we go, one more for me, and I'm running out of steam here for the time being. It says, when carrying the message or speaking at other groups, do I realize that I'm doing this to ensure my own sobriety, that I have only my experience with the AA recovery program to share? And that's why I'm there. Now, I will tell you this. I don't ever think about going to Homeward Bound. I'm probably not thinking, man, I need Homeward Bond to save my behind. that ain't the way I roll that's not the way I think about it I do go to Homeward Bound and 24 Hour Club and wherever else I go I go with a sincere desire to be helpful I got a sincere desire to hopefully make some contact with somebody who was dying just like I was that is that's why I'm there just so I haven't God's taking care of me I'm taking out a little more insurance against me but that's not my it's a little subtle shift in the way I think about it but I'm there because I really want to help and what message am I carrying at these places? There's a whole lot of things I've got to remember at these places. Hey, I'm a guest. If they want to do life stories and trigger lists and Dr. Gorski's relapse prevention manual, good luck. I wish them the best. It ain't my job to criticize that stuff, right? And the gals are going to cover that in detail but I have to remember that because I've been in Homeward Bound for a lot of years, and that has come up so many times. Hey, if the treatment center or the wind-up place doesn't want them doing step work while they're in there, that's their business. My job is to present the program as outlined in this book, not my program, not my thoughts. It's not my job to get up there and have an extemporaneous free-for-all of, as John Kelly sees it, doing my best to imitate Chris Raymer. You know? I can't be Chris Raymour. There's only one Chris and he's Chris. There's a lot of people and there's only one Myers and that's Myers. I've got to be John Kelly. I've Got to get in this book because my sponsor told me get in the book because you can't screw it up and I'm going to carry this message. That's our job and I think I'm about to pass it off to Ed right now. So kind. My name is Ed Posey and I am an alcoholic. I can't help but think, and we're going to do a little reading here and kind of cover a little more of this and get into the questions. But I'm still convinced that the rest of the world and its people are nuts. And Cliff always reminded me, he said, well, that may be true, but, you know, the only difference between you and them, Ed, is you're nuts. They think they're normal. You know you're nut. So having said all that, that's why we're here, and we're here to get better at what we do, and thank God for that. And Dara just penned a little note on here on that one bullet up there. Well, we need all the help we can get. That's why we're hearing it. But on this 12-step stuff and why we do it and carrying this message, yeah, absolutely bottom line is to ensure my own sobriety. But if I didn't get something much more than that, I probably wouldn't be able to continue to have the willingness to do it. And that is, you know, the happiness and the joy we get watching other people recover and watching other peoples' lives get put back together. And Dr. Bob commented he would like to believe perhaps that he's had a small part in that. So he lived long enough and did this long enough to know that ego is always going to be there. And it really can't pay credit for any of this stuff, you now, that I've been doing it to ensure my sobriety, but there is so much more to it. So we'll get into this next little piece on this little thing. And Bill W. wrote, in the years of head AA will, of course, make mistakes. And I'm sure nobody wants to challenge that statement. His experience has taught us we have no fear of doing this. And it's evident by the size of this room that perhaps we don't have. And that's pretty cool. Provided that we're always remain willing to admit our faults and correct them properly. And I just cannot. I'm really overwhelmed at the turnout we have here today. It's phenomenal. Most people, I say most people, you think about it. If you wasn't here, then that might perhaps say, well, I don't need this. I've got it. Perhaps we, like myself included, know that I don'T even come close to getting it perfect and perhaps you're never going to. So our growth as individuals has depended upon this healthy process of trial and error. So will our growth is a fellowship. Let us always remember that any society of men and women that cannot freely correct its own fault must surely fall into decay, if not collapse. Such is the universal penalty for the failure to continue growing and growing. Just as each AA must continue to take his moral inventory and act upon it, so must our whole society if we are to survive and if we were to serve usefully and well. And that's AA comes of age, page 231. The PPG, we've seen our fair shares of crisis problems and differences of opinion. You know when it's a crisis, when I'm emotionally involved in it, the world's coming to an end? Well, think about it. However, we stuck together and have helped each to improve our effectiveness as a whole. If you think about that, and John kind of alluded to it, you know, As we kind of grew and it's being new here, there's no such thing as arriving in Alcoholics Anonymous. But you begin the journey, and I always go back to old David, either a one-year wonder, either a two-year wanderer, either three-year wanderer, either four-year Wanderer. I don't think any of us have stated that. I know personally I did not. I had all the answers before the questions were asked. I came in that way. But I kept an open mind and was willing, and I was teachable. And so that is probably what is required of us, to keep an open mind and be willing, you know? That's all it's asked of us to do. And so in the last 10 years, we've gone from about 20 to 25 people on a Tuesday night, and if you wasn't here when that happened and you said something really lame, it was kind of a humbling experience because the room went dead and there was nowhere to hide. So where we are now, and along the way we've gained many members and friends in AA as well as suffered many tragic losses. And I guess that's one reason we're also here today too is look at perhaps some mistakes we made hopefully and what we could do better. Cliff had printed out some old phone lists and stuff and just kind of checking and we've come to believe that we're probably not doing as good as we could be or should be and Bill will talk about that later on, the good for AA is not going to be what we need. We're going to need the best, the best in sponsorship, the most accountability so that we can retain people so that AA, the lifeline of AA, will be there, you know, and that's what it's all about, self-sacrifice. I don't know about you at Sunday afternoon. I'm sure most of you could probably come up with something else to do and hang out here, huh? Maybe. I don' t know. Because of our size, what may seem like minor problems are magnified, and John touched on that. The little things can overwhelm us. We feel that to remain effective, we as responsible members of the AA should discuss what it takes to be an effective sponsor and a valued member of our group. I'm going to kind of read the definition I kind of thought might fit what a sponsor is out of Webster's. I don't know. I think it's Funkin' Wagnalls. I was always one of the oddball ones. Think about Funkin', Wagnall's. Where does that come from? Laugh-in'. Laughin'. Oh, okay. Laugh in. There you go. Sponsor, one who makes himself responsible for a statement by or a debt or duty of another. I think that clearly fits what we kind of define as sponsorship in here, is when I assume the responsibility of sponsorship for someone, it means I'm going to assume the responsibilities of their actions. And it's pretty simple. If you want what I got, then you're going to do what I did, and that's all I have to kind of show you, you know. Our book talks about the ex-problem drinker who has found this solution. and is properly armed with the facts about himself. Am I responsible? And we kind of touched on 12-step, and we'll get a little bit more than that. And a great example of 12-stepping, we always refer back to Fred's story, a classic example of how they told him the problem. They didn't tell him what he needed to do. They didn' t really go into any detail telling him what they did. They continued to talk about alcoholism. Perhaps you don't have the mind of a chronic alcoholic, but just keep in mind, if it does happen again, we understand. And then they encouraged Fred to do basically whatever he thought he needed to do. But the seed had been planted. They had parted on a friendly ending to their deal and just let them know that they were available to him, as we all should be doing with people that we come in contact with because, as you know, alcoholism is a self-diagnosed illness. And I love what Joe used to say. Those that say they got it probably don't. The ones that say absolutely not, they probably do, you know. Dr. Bob did take the matter of sponsorship very seriously. History shows that he helped approximately 500 alcoholics experience the promises of the program of Alcoholics Anonymous over a 10-year period. That turns out to an average of one and a half new alcoholics every day over that ten year period, and I thought I was doing good. That would certainly qualify as intensive work with other alcoholics. So it would appear to make sense if we've been restored to sanity where alcohol is concerned To follow the directions of the first 100 laid down for us in our basic text, I'll collect synonymous. And apply the 12-step prayer as directed, which is, Ask me any morning meditation which you can do each day for the man who is still sick. The answer will come if your own house is in order. But you obviously cannot transmit something you haven't got. See that your relationship with him is right and great events will come to pass to you and for countless others this is a great fact for us. A.A., Big Book, page 164. We've been really emphasizing this, and I go back to what I kind of prefaced a while ago about having people here in positions of responsibility. You know, as we begin this journey, it must continue for those yet to come. And Bill realized this, and leadership in AA, every vital need, and that's language of the heart, page 292. It's kind of like John kind of alluded about this, that whatever he said about crossing the road, God's not going to pay my bills, whatever. I don't know what he said a minute ago. Nowhere could this be more true than the area of 12-step work. We do need leaders in AI and we need qualified sponsors in AI. And whatever role, if you continue to go into service or serve in other areas, leadership is required of us. Now, there's a difference between leadership and dictatorship, true? So we lead by example by applying the principles in our life and following directions in the book and getting firmly grounded in, if you do go into the service level, all 36 traditions, concepts, and steps. I don't want to call it a step program, but there's 36 elements to it. So the stakes are huge. You better believe it. A human life and usually the happiness of a whole family hangs in the balance. What more could you be called to serve that would be serving for the good? I mean, that's pretty dad-blessed. I know when you're new, you think, my God, what a responsibility. And John alluded to it a while ago, as I was always told, stay in the book, Ed. You can't screw them up. But step outside the book. Well, what a sponsor does and says and how well he times and makes his presentation and how well he handles criticism and how well he leads his prospect on by his personal spiritual example. Walk the walk, the talk's not that important. Well, these attributes of leadership can make all the difference often between life and death. So I don't know. We're going to kick this thing around here, and if you have comments or questions or some experience or something you need to share, please raise your hand because we're going kind of pause in between each one of these questions. We move through this thing, and I'll take it down so far, and I may kick the last half off to John. I'm not sure. You know, we just kind of improvise as we go along. I don't think John and I are kind of the same. You put a script up in front of us, and we just sort of freeze. Sponsorship inventory Both you and the new man must walk day by day in the path of spiritual progress Remember that our program is one which requires rigorous honesty Question 1 Have I honestly had a spiritual awakening spiritual experience or psychic change as a result of following the clear cut directions in the basic text of Alcoholics Anonymous Fair question isn't it I used to do this with a lot of people and I still do if I'm just 12-stepping them. Maybe they're just kind of on the fence and haven't decided whether or not they need to do this or not and they're asking me questions about sponsorship. I pose that to them to ask the person that they may ask to help them, have you had a spiritual awakening in your life through the steps? And I also will tell them if they bop, they don't know, then perhaps you need to go find somebody else. Trust me, if I was going in for an operation and I had brain cancer, I'm not going to John Kelly to help me. Although I think he probably could perform brain surgery, I have my reservations about that. But do we treat this any differently? This is the question I have to ask. If I really understand this is life and death, then perhaps the person I'm presenting this to or passing information on to that they understand what it is they need to be looking for when they ask somebody to help them. I don't want somebody, you know, I mean, it may work for them, but we need to Be Clear on talking to these people, at least if they're not ready now, that they will have an opportunity later on when they get to that point where most of us have to get, right? Shall I kill myself now? No, maybe later, you Know. Do I clearly understand that my real purpose in learning to live by the 12 steps is to fit myself to be a maximum service to God and the people he places in my life. And the only way I know how to do that is by trying to live by steps 10, 11, and 12. I can only speak for myself and my own experience prior to being able to get hold of this program and try to apply it in my wife how I used to try to fit yourself to be a maximum serviceman. I don't know so much about God but the people about me. And it wasn't so much about me serving them. It was about them trying to serve me. I'm sure nobody did that, true. And, you know, the truth is without 10, 11, and 12, I can still fall back into that. And that's why steps 10,11,12 were the things that discipline me. In the book it says we'll let God discipline us in the way we just outlined. We're talking steps 10.11 and 12. And when I do that, then I can kind of perhaps get in that spiritual condition where I can be of service as opposed to being served. And as a result of serving, thenI get what I need. This is a crazy thing, but this is how it kind of works. And that's a question that, you know, we'll always have to continually look at as I go through here, you now, instead of thinking, well, today Ed's purpose is to go to work and get everybody to act the way I want them to act, you kno? We good? Head's bobbing in the back there in the nosebleed section. Dave in the closet, I can see your smiling teeth. I'm glad you brushed. Do I understand except the personal challenge of honoring the creed of Alcoholics Anonymous? And we've been covering that. where anyone, anywhere reaches for help. I want the hand of AA to always be there, and for that I'm responsible. I don't know about you all, but I was a taxi when I first got sober. I took them home. I put money in their pockets. I did all kinds of stuff. Went down to Salvation Army and caught them drunks going to shelter at night, you know, and they kept me sober, butI don't kow how much I helped them. But what we're talking about here is, am I really responsible? Somebody reaches out for help, 12-step call. Am I willing to set aside what I am doing at that time because of life or death matter is before me? You can ask my wife wherever she went. Where'd she go? She's over hiding behind a cliff. And we kind of have this thing. There's a difference between what we'RE talking about her and playing taxi service. If we're on a family affair or something like that, if we've got something going on, somebody truly reaches out and they truly need some help and they're in a desperate situation, I will stop what I'm doing. I'll bet you're all. Think about that. I'm not talking about somebody calling with a tenth step and having a goofy day. I'm talking about that drunk on the other end of the line who's begging and pleading for somebody to come down there and help him. That's what I am talking about. Just food for thought. Am I truly responsible? Can I really realize that everything I have today is a direct result of the things I've been shown, the price that the gentleman before me paid so that he could keep what he had by only trying to help somebody like himself? And then if I stop doing that, I'm right back where I was, if not worse than I ever was before, and I might not have another chance to get back. Kind of. Four, if given the opportunity to help an alcoholic, am I willing to go anywhere, anytime? Oh, man. If I'm unable to do so, do I make certain another person will? We are truly blessed beyond what I believe a lot of areas or maybe other groups perhaps do. I mean, we have a lot OF people that will, if I'm in a position that I couldn't do it, that I thought perhaps could call, that I depend upon, that we can actually do that. You're thinking, please don't pat yourself on the back and get the arm extensions out here. We have a lot of people that are willing to do that. And unfortunately, there are a lot areas perhaps that people aren't. If you go back in the beginning, they dropped everything. I can only imagine what it would have been like back then when they had the old beat-up cars they did and the roads weren't worth a damn. They were coming out of depression. Nobody had any damn money. Somebody said, Joe's over here drunk, pissed and killed himself. He asked us to come over. They all piled in a damn old Ford and they drove over there and whatever it took to get there, and they got an old drill and they drug him upstairs and dried him out and helped him get sober. Think about that. Well, today I'm busy. These are questions I'm not asking you so much. These are the questions I have to ask myself. Okay. Do I really understand that I'm ensuring my sobriety by taking advantage of every opportunity I'm given. Anybody that's ever done this has never walked out of one of these places having done this feeling worse or in worse shape for having gone as opposed to staying home, kind of what John was referring to as a little mental masturbation game here, you know, not feeling good and not wanting to do this and got difficulties going on. You know, I don't want to go do that. I'm going to stay here, you know. But if I go do this and I get home and all of a sudden things are better, you know. Pretty amazing stuff, isn't it? Am I one of those who might try to help someone if it isn't inconvenient? Oh, my God. If you've ever done the night watch phones, you just, if you were, I'm going to say this, and I don't say it to talk untimely about it, but it's more of the truth than anything else. If you were just to start at that phone list and go down, you're going to find a lot of people that are too busy to do this stuff. You know, maybe it works for them. I don' t know. But it's definitely not what was outlined in what these cats did in the beginning. It's not what I've been shown to do by my sponsor, and perhaps you like your sponsor. When given the opportunity to help someone, Do I consider it a boast to my ego, or do I honestly realize I'm accepting responsibly for an alcoholic's life? Boy, you know, we hit them serious when everybody gets real quiet. You know, it says we do have a lot of fun in the fellowship and stuff, but just underneath it lies this deadly earnestness. And that's really what, when we cut to the chase and kind of get down to where it's all about and why we're doing this. This is really what it is. And my job, as John said, is to carry this message and make myself available to them. And that's all I have. I don't have the secret handshake, the pat on the back. I can't get up with the pom-poms and cheer you into sobriety. I would like to. It'd make my life a lot easier. I'd like to do it for you and it'd make me feel better. It'd just make my wife a lot easier, you know? Do I know how to determine if the prospect fully understands the seriousness of alcoholism, they have a complete willingness to go to any lengths to survive it. This is an area, God knows I'm guilty of it, early on this Friday and today hopefully got a little bit better. And we don't start out at sponsorship being the best. We learn from our mistakes we talk about and we get better at it. Today, you know, I understand to listen to what this individual has to say and they've got to convince me whether or not they're an alcoholic of the hopeless variety. And if I'm not convinced at this point, I need not take them through the steps. Anybody know why? If it doesn't work for them, they go back to drink. And they've gone to church. They've moved out of town. They've got three girlfriends instead of two. They've got two cars instead of one. They've done everything on God's green earth they can possibly come up with to stay sober. And they're running through their heads going, now what can I do? And I said, but I tried AA and it doesn't work. What are their options? I don't have the facts, but I've always heard that collectively as a group of people we have a real high suicide rate sober. We've had them do it in this group. And if I understand that, then I'm really doing them a disservice. Working with others gets clear about this and rushing somebody through it when they really don't understand why they're doing it. You understand what I'm saying? I have to go back in Detox 94 and I'm sitting there and they're carrying this message in and all this other stuff and I was asked, do you want what we have? Well, here I've got all my belongings in a little duffel bag, right, and I smell pretty bad. They got some foo-foo juice on, Got a nice gold chain around her neck, right? Got that shitty grin on her face. I'm like, absolutely, I want what you have, you know. They weren't offering that. And see, this is where perhaps I made a lot of mistakes early on and it's so easy to get into it when you're newly sponsored. That's why it's important for me today and the people I sponsor. They call me and let me know what's going on and the same questions need to be asked. They need to convince me they're an alcoholic. And then the question is, are you willing to go to England? And then comes that old thing, we'll see, you know. It becomes real simple at that point, but the hardest thing is to get to that point. Do I understand my responsibility as a guide to prospect who asks for help, learn to follow and live by the clear-cut directions in the basic text? And that ties into what we're kind of talking about here. This group, and this next little bullet here And I'm going to pass this back to John after this I'll cover this one though Having taken my prospect through the steps Do I understand my next responsibility Is to help them understand the importance of the twelve traditions And the twelve concepts And that's particularly true and necessary If they're going to go into service And boy not everybody is cut out for service And I am one that's not But thank God that we need people in service It may be that you are And if that being the case, you're definitely going to need to understand those concepts. The traditions though are a necessity. They follow with the steps and it's how we conduct ourselves and how we stay unified as a group and how can work together because as our book says, we come from all different backgrounds, social, economic, and we all have various thoughts and opinions and so forth and whatnot. But we only have one purpose in Alcoholics Anonymous, and that's to try to live by the 12 steps and try to adhere to the 12 traditions. And other than that, we have no purpose. So we're talking about within the fellowship of AlcoholicsAnonymous and within a group confines that these are the things we do. And if you ever get hold of the traditions, and we used to have studies of the tradition here. We do cover them each week, but we don't cover them perhaps like we once did because the group's gotten so big, so therefore it's going to fall slowly upon, and trust me, I fall short of this. It came real clear to me when I was going over this how I was missing with some of the people I was working with on hate. I'm assuming that they've had the same opportunity that I was given, that they were doing the same things. No, we've gotten so big, so now the responsibility of me is to take my prospects through the traditions. Okay, I'm going to let John kind of finish this thing out, and if we get any comments or something like that, I'll kick it back to you, big guy. Does anybody have any questions up to this point? Is everybody holding up okay? You're all good? Y'all are so welcome. Not one question. All right, Terry, good man. Stand up. Stand up, Terry. You know, I work in a lot of different things. I wind up doing this. And I get my number out a lot and I get calls from a lot of guys who they leave the wind-up door and they're out running the streets and they look for somebody to come and pick them up and give them a ride and find them a place to stay. And am I there for that all the time? Am I there to clean up their mess? No. Next? No. Hey, look, you know, as part of our experience, you know, I don't know all the ins and outs, but I got guys that I sponsor that know some of those things better than I do about where they go. And sure, you're going to have a percentage of people who want me to clean up their mess and take them to get their ID, take them to where, you know, you can't do that. I'm going to do my best to help where I can. It's not my job. My job is to carry the message, not carry the drunk, right? But I'm going to do my best. I'm gonna do my Best to try to help them out. Hey, I know these three halfway houses over here. You might want to give them a call or how about the 24th? I do what I can. I'm not ever going to just drop somebody and give them a no, can't help you. It's Not my job I'm Going to do what I can because I would that's the way I mean, it's just my personal thing. That's the Way I would want to be treated but sometimes were put in those positions where they need five bucks for the bus so they can get a job. And I tell you, just from reading up on the traditions and having our � back in the day when it was small, we don't do it anymore, but when this group was small we did a tradition study on Thursdays. And I learned so much from Cliff and Ed and Darren and Sandy. It was so great because those helped me put into perspective. And you always hear the story about Bill Wilson who sees a drunk that he tried to help on the street in New York City and the guy needed some help and Bill flips him a $5 bill. And then Bill feels good about himself and he goes to the meeting that night and the basket is passed and he tosses in a nickel. And then it hits him. Wow. Who was that $5 about? That wasn't about helping that guy. That was about helping Bill. And Bill sacrificed his new fledgling group in order to boost his own ego. And I got to practice that, and I've done it a bunch of times, but the big first time was at 24-Hour Club. This guy I love to death, his name's Steve Rutledge, drank everything away. He's in a busted up Winnebago at the 24-hour club and doesn't have a pot to piss in. and this guy had been around AA for years and I take him under his wing and we had like one or two meetings. We identified, he made a beginning, he did his third step prayer. It was on a Sunday night after the meeting and he's like, man, I don't have any money and I was just wondering if you could help me out and man, I had money in my pocket and I wanted to help this guy out and I said, you know, I would really like to do that but this is what I think would work best He said, when I leave, why don't you go sit on the steps over there and have a little quiet time? And I said, I know you've worked in doing rehab and remodels of buildings and stuff like that. Why don't after you have a Little Quiet Time, go talk to these managers in the office here at 24-Hour Club and see if they could use you around here. And maybe they'll throw you some work and let you eat and all that stuff. And call me in a day. Let me know how that works out. Well, it's 24-hour club. God dang, they need work for everything. They need crap painted, tore down. He had more work that he could spit at. I felt horrible driving away because I wanted to give him $20. But I got to put these principles into play. He probably would have got sober if I would have gotten $20, I don't know, who knows. But I did and I stuck by the principles and instead we both got to grow, right? And he didn't rely on me and it was great. And I hope that answers your question a little bit. I'm going to do what I can. In working with others, there are two places that I'm sure you've seen. One says that the minute we put our work on a service plane, the alcohol starts depending upon us rather than upon God. And then another place it says that it's not a matter of giving that's in question, but when and how to give. So there's not an formula for what we do in every situation. Every situation is different, and the help of my sponsor, I can get there. I can figure out just when it's the right time to give and not give. I'm going to tag on to what Cindy � go ahead, Cliff. I can't resist this. If you're talking to somebody and they are not serious about the program and they want to pay their money or whatnot, ask them who the hell bought their food for them. Yeah, really? We've come to places in real life. How far would they go to get the test positive? How far are they willing to go to survive alcoholism? You're right on target. That is a response that I've given to them when they start using me as a way out to take care of their problems. I'm not here to solve problems, but I'm sure if y'all see one of these plans, you might be able to solve this problem. I'll shut that off as well. No, thanks, Cliff. And I was just going to tag on this because Cindy alluded to it, and it's simply that. And I'll just say this, and I'll show you what I mean. I'm going to shut up on this, because there's going to be those times when perhaps you do give, but one more time, I think somebody that's a member of this group for years and years and I work with them, became almost on a friendship basis. And I realize today when it comes on that level, I become an ineffective sponsor. So one of the last times they were carrying him out on a stretcher and putting him in detox at the hospital, and I went over and picked him up and took him to a Salvation Army shelter. And I gave him $20, and I simply said, Steve, this is probably not helping you. You can buy something to eat or you can buy a bottle. Being the good drunk he was, he bought a bottle, but that's what we need to be clear on. If we do take that, that that's why we're doing it. And so that they understand that, that it wasn't about me being a sponsorship or he was a friend of mine and I, you know, but I made it clear he's going to do one of two things with it. So there's your question of giving. Very good. Anybody else have a question? All right. Yeah, this is . Well, I mean, if I can help it, if I can manage it, what I like to do is I call one of my new guys and say, hey, get ready. I'm coming to get you. Meet me here. We're going to do this. I'm going to use my best judgment. You know, if it's 3 o'clock in the morning, I may want to try another cacti rather than being noon at Starbucks, you know what I mean? We're going to use our best judgment. But it is very helpful to go with other people. A lot of people don't do it. They won't 12-step. They don't call on a wet drum. And my God, that is some precious stuff. You Know, I had a guy in Parkland not too long ago and just the way it happened I had to go solo, but it all worked out the way it was supposed to work out. But if I can bring a newcomer with me or one of my guys with me or somebody I know, I'm going to do that just to have two voices in that room. Not out of fear or anything, but it's very helpful at times. I was just going to tell you about one of our old sponsors. They called her Slippy when she came in and out at another group. And she always, she said never dare, never, never go on a call by yourself because I did one time the couple called me out in the country and I drove and drove with good intentions all the way out there. And the husband and wife they were fighting and acting ugly to one another and they had a bottle right in the middle of the table and they told me their woes And she said, it was so bad I asked him to just pour me a drink too. So I don't think if you're in this spiritual condition, it can be done. But obviously she admitted she wasn't. She was out there for the drama and, you know, whatever else that comes with that. But I know that. That's in my head. That's a good one. All right, good times. Number 10, do I insist that they search for those they think can help? That is their responsibility to try to help others as I've tried to help them. Insist, mandate, I don't know, what do you want to call it? I mean, just anybody can get sober and stay in a room of Alcoholics Anonymous and let the game come to them. But that ain't the way I drank, and that's not the way my sponsor showed me. My first Friday that I was sober, my sponsor said, since you came through Homeward Bound, go there. You know? When I get a new guy, he's going to follow me around and we're going to do this. We know how to find drunks. And we can't get all complacent and sit in this room and come in here and have great little big book studies Tuesdays, Thursdays, and a set speaker on Saturdays and think that all is well in the world. Because out there, they're dying. And that's why we have all these opportunities on the bulletin board for us to get out of ourselves, take some time out of our important lives to go out amongst our people and try to carry this message. So, yeah, I insist. You know, I mean, I ask my guys, did you drink every day? Great. Good. This will be perfect for you because we're going to rock and roll this way. You know? I drank. I was blacked out drunk every day. My sobriety is no different. I know there's people out there that go to the noon, the six, or the eight, or whatever, and they don't read the book. They don't hit a lick of 12-step stuff, and they're sober. Right? Awesome. That is not my truth. Because if I could have done that, I'd have 20-something years of sobriety today, and I don't. Because just sitting in meetings talking about stuff is not going to save my behind. What saves my behind is these principles and these traditions and getting out and carrying the message. So I try to help them understand that to the extent that they learn to live by our program, will they have a solution to all their problems that I don't have the answers for them? Listen, this program answers all my problems. Why? Because it's God. God answers all of my problems, right? Now, you may say, well, I have a big book in his program. How is that going to save my rent? I don?t know. That's the same exact question I had when I was two weeks sober and I asked Cliff that very question. I'm about to be fired tomorrow. They're not going to pay me enough to pay these bills. I'm sober, and now I'm going to be homeless living in a van down by the river. And he asked me the point blank question, do you have a dollar? Yes, I have a dolla. Great. I'm hanging up now. When I hang up, you say a prayer. Get your big book. Get your dollar. go to 24-hour club, buy a Coke, talk to every son of a gun that walks through that cafeteria there, stay there for a couple hours, call me when you get home. Click. Cliff didn't pay my rent. He didn't know how he was going to pay my rate. I didn't want to drink first and foremost. So I took that path and did what the program says. And lo and behold, I didn' t get fired and I paid my bills. And I didn''t live in a van down by the river. How does that work? I don't know. But that story is replicated, and look at everybody in this room. Because how do good things happen in our lives for which we otherwise couldn't account? I mean, look at anybody's story in this world. In this room, we're doing stuff. We've cheated death, you know. So are we going to be willing to pay the price? And I've got to pay The Price each day in my sobriety. I'm more important, I've Got to Pay The Price today in my subriety Has my ego been deflated enough to realize that I've only been given the power to help and that I do not have all the answers and all the solutions to all my problems and that the solutions for all my problem line apply in the 12 steps? Good God. I mean, I can't solve anything. All I can do is rely upon the program, rely upon God and the wisdom of my sponsor and his experience, right? I don't have the answers. I don' t know how some of this works. It blows my mind to this day. I mean, my life is a perfect example. How do I have what I have today? Because where I'm at today and from where I was ten years ago, I can't get there from here. It ain't possible. So has my ego been deflated? Well, you know what? Practicing these principles helps me keep my, and practicing these traditions helps the ego. Because left unchecked, I get a big head. And I think, oh, I've got 43 guys that I sponsor and five out-of-state ones and this and that and all this stuff. That's me to my own devices. I can tell you today, I got no idea how many guys I sponsor. Don't know, don't care. If Brad Hall becomes AA guru of the world, I don't get the credit. You know? Well, maybe in Brad, no. But you did. That's why I call my... See, if we're doing 10, 11, and 12, if we'RE doing the things, I am responsible. Am I responsible? Am I getting to the group early? Am I talking to the guy that I don't know? Am I trying to show somebody where the bathroom is? Am I doing the thing? Am I not trying to help out? If I'm doing 10-11-12, those things keep the ego in check. am I calling my sponsor when I screw up that keeps the ego in check because my mind will always come up with I got all the answers and sadly I don't have very many answers you know and thankfully there's enough people around I get to learn by some of you I try to learn by your mistakes frankly you know I see where you screw up I don' t want to do that hopefully you can learn by some of mine we can walk this path together right Oh, I love this one. Do I hold my prot�g�s accountable? That's a bad word sometimes in AA, right? Or do I enable them by accepting their excuses? Thanks for listening.