The First Three Steps and Spiritual Awakening – Herb K – Workshop – Part 3 of 25 – Herb

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening wherever you are in the world today. Thank you very much for joining us. My name is Herb. I'm an alcoholic. Welcome to our big book Zoom 12-step workshop. Please join me in prayer for an open mind. God, please set aside everything that I think I know about myself, my brokenness, the 12 steps and you for an open mind and a new experience of myself. My brokenness the 12 Steps and especially you. Please join me in the serenity prayer. God grant me the serenergy to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference. We've been on the journey for a while now. Bill uses the metaphor the rocket launch. and the interesting part of that is that although we need to get into the rocket once the rocket's launched the rocket takes us to the destination and as we reviewed before we even began this process at the very early stages of our gathering the destination is a spiritual awakening a destination is a relationship with light a destination is to be placed in orbit around that light staying with the rocket launch metaphor most of us because of suffering from some form of addiction seek a resource for resolution through the 12 steps. That's why we're here. Some of us have had that experience of freedom from our suffering, from our addiction, but we're still suffering from life, from reality, from our ineffectiveness in dealing with our life. And some of us who have done even some work and had some graces have the gift of a very serene flourishing life and yet we know there's more like so it doesn't matter why you're here the rocket will take you to a place that you probably don't even know exists and yet you suspected freedom certainly from your addiction freedom certainly from unmanageability those are wonderful experiences gifts of this process but even a life that flourishes on a continuous basis not free from pain but free from suffering big difference we learn in that first step that we're powerless to deal effectively with our addiction and even and especially to deal effectively reality and our life unmanageable and this is a process that gives us the power and a relationship with power to manage our lives in a very healthy way but we need to find that power and we have navigated a process through step two in chapter four we were asked by the book and by my own experience several questions as we read and reread and re-read and discussed forever the big book and our concepts and our resistances and our negativities and our doubts and our hopes and our expectations and we came to a conclusion that was the invitation last week to come to a a conclusion. God is a choice, a free will choice, or at the very least that there is a power. I don't know what its name is. I don't know that it is but I hope that it isn't I'm choosing that it is and I'm going to now conduct myself as if it's real. That step two a faith decision with no evidence and then we move forward the next step organically launched from step one powerlessness into step two of search for power and organically launched from there that search for Power once we make this decision that it exists and that it exist deep in me that i can have a relationship with it and that it's a caring power the implications of step three well let's read step three made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of god as we understood god very interesting very dense very succinct needs quite a bit of unpacking which we will do over the next three workshops made a decision oh again like step two an act of my free will a decision the word surrender is not in the big book in the first 164 pages the word surrenders not in the big book as I understand it the word surrender is not in The Twelve and Twelve in the step dialogue I heard it early in the meetings I mouthed it for a long time ten years in the meetings because it sounded good and it It felt right as I didn't understand the depth of step three. But now I do, I understand step three, at least that's my interpretation and I've experienced step three and surrender has no place in step three Surrender has a big place in Step one completely defeated the white flag i give up i surrender i cannot do this neither with my addiction nor with my managing my life i surrender I give up I'm defeated white flag surrenders fabulous word for step one the reality is of course I was surrendered even there I was powerless to surrender but let's move on so what is step three made a decision it's a ferocious act of my will not willfulness but willingness willfulness is what we looked at in unmanageability self-centered that unhealthy ego all about me i'm the center of the universe that's the unhealthy part we saw in unmanageability manifested in those bedevilments but willingness that's The Cornerstone Bill says on page 47 placed on the foundation that sets the direction of the spiritual arch through which we're going to walk to a new freedom. Willingness is a decision, he says on page 53. What is your choice? And now very formally in step three, he says, made a decision. I make a decision I'm moving forward based on my decision in step two to have our relationship in step three. Bill is not that clear about the term relationship, but when we get to pages 62 and 63 next week, that's the assignment for next week. I had you read 58 to 60 this week, and I'm going to unpack that now. But going forward, pages 62 and 63 really unpacks and reveals the nature of step three, a relationship. And it gives us five relationships, three at the bottom of page 62, one in the first paragraph on 63, and another one on the second paragraph on page 63. I'm saying that so that you can pay attention to it when you reread that material for next week, between now and next week. Bill asked us a fabulous question at the beginning of Step 2, where and how are we going to find that power? That question on page 45. Where and how? And he answers it later on, on page 55. He does the same thing on page 60, which we will look again at next week. What do we mean and how do we do this, turning our will in our life over to God? Over to the power of God. Over to care of God? What do you mean by it and what do you do? Pay attention. Those are questions that Bill uses that are not just throwaway questions. They're not just poetic or literary style. No, this is a pedagogy, a method of study, a method I've been biting us to ask a question to hold the question as we're reading the material that comes after it because he answers it specifically. But he warms us up to it on pages 58 to 60. How it works. What a great title. How it Works. rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path I think the operative word there is thoroughly this material in step 3 has more absolutes and ideals than any other section of the step process absolutes and visions and ideals that he doesn't use in any other step to continue the architectural analogy. He uses the word keystone, the third step, in contrast to the second step, the second set being the cornerstone. The third step is the keystone in this arch. Keystone, that component of this construction site at the apex of the arch that holds the entire arch together. That's how important it is, the third step. But there's no action here. There's no option in step one except collapse. There's not action in step two except a decision and some hope. And there's really no action in steps three other than praying a prayer. but step three is the commitment witnessed in public prayer because he invites us to pray it with somebody else a witness in public pray to take the actions of steps four through nine which he very carefully says on page 64 that is necessary for anything to happen because making the decision and praying the prayer might make you feel good for a minute but it won't last that's my interpretation of what he says on page 64. step three is not about action it's about a commitment to action rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program. Obviously, the operative word in that partial sentence is completely. Hear the absolute, the black and white of this. bill holds very high standards the big book holds very high standards here in step three but that's why on page 60 he says relax it's not about perfection it's about progress we're not saints we're human beings we make progress like the dimmer switch great metaphor here for us on this journey it goes up a click at a time But only if we keep our shoulder connected to the dimmer switch. Look at my hands. If you keep the shoulder connected to the demerswitch, leaning gently into it but pushing it forward one notch at a time, the lights get brighter. We might not know that they're getting brighter when they're going up only subtly, incrementally, one click at a times. but eventually there will be a sufficient amount of light that we know that there is more light for the very first time those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves we hear this material at least in AA in most of the meetings that we go to almost every meeting has this as its opening kind of reading to set the stage how it works and because and it's very appropriate but because we hear it so often we become brain dead to it we actually don't know what it says oh some of us have memorized it some of use could spout it off by by rote but we still don't know what it means because we've forgotten or we never really understood the words that's why i'm taking my time with it we're going to look at every sentence men and women who are constitutionally incapable constitutionally what does that mean oh by their very constitution meaning their very biological genetics predisposition they are not capable perhaps the sociopath or the psychopath serious bill spends three four five sentences on this concept it's that important because people who come into program are severely damaged some from drugs and alcohol some from trauma some from predisposition of mental illness and or biological distortions so he's really addressing it here they are there are such unfortunates they are not at fault they seem to have been born that way you see how he reinforces the biological perspective he's having here biological genetically predisposed they're not capable of being honest they are naturally incapable naturally by their very nature grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty that's the reason he's spending the time here this is the key principle rigorous honesty again a very high standard rigorous honesty not just honesty he puts a jackhammer word an adjective behind the word jackhammer rigorous honesty their chances are less than average all right they don't have much of a chance now he takes it to the next level pay attention there are those two who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders notice he's using two different words he means two different categories emotional is different than mental. That's a pretty sophisticated sentence. Bill was being guided by psychiatrists and psychologists at the time, but he says many of these do recover if they have the capacity to be honest. They're damaged, but they're not so damaged that they don't have the capacity with some work, maybe some therapy, maybe with some medication. The other category of people are not going to be subject to therapy and medication. They're pretty irretrievable. It's what he's really saying. Their chances are less than average being kind. Our stories disclose in a general way, what we used to be like what happened and what we are like now. What we were like, what happened in what we are like now, before we came into the recovery program, then the recovery program and its influence of us and now how are we? And the whole point of that is identification, of course, for people the story is not important other than the fact is oh i well i am like you were but you are not like that now and you did this maybe if i do that i'll be like that and i'll get what i want to need the whole point of telling our story is identification not entertainment if you have decided you want what we have and are willing to go to any length to get it that was the question I asked you to ask yourself right at the beginning of our journey are you willing to go to any lenght and what does it mean and he tells us here dash then you are ready to take certain steps you see he's warming us up here to the commitment in prayer in step three, and then to the action of steps four through nine. That's what he means by any length. He doesn't mean anything dramatic or in any type of, how would you say, uncommon sense. He just means doing steps four through nine. At some of these we balked. An unusual term. Most of us who know anything about baseball can relate to the term balk, which is what the pitcher does when he winds up and he begins to throw at the batter but midway through stops. He doesn't finish the pitch. He doesn't throw the ball this is a reference to people who start the step work they may do step three and entertain a little bit of step four and then either get scared or bored or get distracted or they do the fourth step but they don't complete the sex inventory or they do the forth step and they don t do their fifth step or they d o their fifth step and don't do their six and seven step or they do their sixth and seventh step and then they wow they found an awful lot of freedom and they don't do eight and nine who would want to do eight of nine repairing the damage that you've done not by your addiction but by your dysfunctional personality at some of these we bought i think he could have said at all of these steps we bought That's my experience personally, as well as listening to other people. We thought we could find an easier, softer way. I lose a lot of people to therapy. I lose all the time. I lose the time to talk to a lot of people, to organize religion. I lose, I lose a lot of people to work or to relationships. Once they do for the first three steps, they feel a lot better and they just say, got it now. Got it. Yeah, not, not, not, I'm too busy to do the rest of this work. Not necessary. But we could not, with all the earnestness that our command, we beg of you to be fearless and thorough from the very start. Some of us have tried to hold on to our old ideas and the result was nil until we let go absolutely. That was the line I used to invite you into the set-aside attitude and the set aside prayer. let go your old ideas your older knowledge your old experience and pray for it actually to be changed not by you but by the intervention of the spirit and he uses the term we let go absolutely again that high standard Bill did not use any of the four absolutes from the Oxford group but he certainly held very high standards of absolute here in the step three instructions. Remember that we deal with alcohol, cunning, baffling, powerful without help. It is too much for us. There is one who has all power, a decision you made in step two. That one is God. That's your decision, what you call it. G-O-D is merely a symbol of that reality that has no symbol and no adequate words. We've had that conversation. may you find him now you see we're seekers may you find this power now this is the beginning of finding that power and establishing a relationship with that power half measures availed us nothing half measures won't get you 50% now if we do the best we can even though it's not the best мы can that is the best WE CAN That's not a half measure. That's a full measure to the best of our ability. I hope you can hear the subtlety of the difference of that. We stood at the turning point, made a decision to turn. Those are the words in the book. We stood up. We stood down at the starting point. Bill captured that and we saw it last week when we reviewed the last part of Bill's story, we reviewed it again on page 14. Simple but not easy. A price had to be paid. What's the price? It meant the destruction of self-centeredness. How can I do that? I must turn in all things to the Father of light who presides over us all. This is the turning he is talking about here on page 14. I must turn in all things to light, that transcendent reality. We stood at the turning point. We asked. Again, that's code for prayer, isn't it? Whenever we're asking God, asking higher power, asking a power other than ourself, that'S a prayer. We're talking to this power, asking for protection, asking for intervention, protection and care with complete abandon. That word cares right in the step itself made a decision to turn our will and our life over to the care, not over to God. God gave us by the assumptions of the big book, a very christian orientation god created us god gave us free will god gave us a mind to think god doesn't want us to turn us over to god at least that's my anthropomorphic interpretation I was given free will in order to use my free will. My free will, and I'm using my free will in step two to say I decide there is a God. I'm choosing my free will here in step three to say, and I am choosing to have a relationship with it. Here the willingness of that the what bill would call the absolute healthy and right use correct use proper use of the willpower i'm not gonna oh we asked his protection and care with complete abandon there again that absolute can i abandon myself no i don't even know what that means does that mean i'm going to do this work and become a spiritual person and wear saffron robes and stand on the streets with a begging bowl yeah no that's just an old idea no it means i'm gonna live like a decent human being in alignment with reality more about that in a minute page 60 many of us exclaimed what an order the 12 steps that he had just listed there it's an impressive and overwhelming list at the beginning of our journey the fourth step inventory and the nine-step amends especially very intimidating to people perhaps who are not used to self-reflection and introspection i can't go through with it do not be discouraged no one among us has been able to maintain anything like perfect adherence to these principles notice he uses a term here as a synonym for steps because he doesn't want to use the same word in consecutive sentences principles. That's a synonym for steps here. We are not saints. We are not perfect, nor will we ever be perfect. Please, there's 30 or 40 percent of you I know that are perfectionists. That's not a badge of sanity or courage. It's actually a symptom of being severely neurotic. the point is that we are willing to grow along spiritual lines oh we're not saints we're willing to go along here at the dimmer switch here we're going to grow a long spiritual lines the principles we have set down our guides to progress the principles these steps are guard rails and guidelines guide rails to walking the human path of evolution, human evolution to being optimally human. The proper use of my mind and the proper use of my will. The proper used of my mind is to know what reality is and the proper use that my will is in fact to cooperate accept and adjust to reality. I I don't have to use spiritual terms. I don' t have to traditional religious terms here. I'm talking about human development. We claim spiritual progress rather than spiritual perfection. That dimmer switch is on an infinite axle in pursuit of an infinite light. That's the magic here. There's always going to be more light, which is really good news for anybody is really an addict because we always want more and there always will be more more light more power more knowledge more consciousness more more happiness more joy not in the sense of the high that comes from a really strong cup of coffee or a really large bowl of ice cream or adrenaline no no i don't mean that that high of that satisfaction of being really conscious and really connected and really in harmony with reality our description of the alcoholic well i'm a big book literalist and fundamentalist what is he meaning here he's about to give us a wrap-up our description of the alcoholic oh yeah doctor's opinion chapters one two and three that was all about alcohol and the disintegration that comes from alcohol or any form of addiction next phrase the chapter to the agnostic oh yeah that's chapter four then he pauses because this is where we're at and our personal adventures before and after our experiences before coming into the program and our experiences after coming into the program make clear three pertinent things now this is the platform a recap of steps one and two and a bridge to step three a that we were alcoholic first half of the first step we would substitute the word addict here because you it's a invitation in this workshop to anybody with any addiction not just alcohol a that we were an addict and could not manage our own lives second half of the first step b that probably no human power could have relieved our alcoholism that was our transition into step two see that god could this is now our deep dive into step two there is a power that has a sufficient power that is deep down inside of me that god could and would oh and that it is a benevolent power a caring power and we're reaching over the bridge to step three made a decision to turn our will and our life over to the care if god were sought there's the condition meaning continue to do the work of steps four through nine which is clearing out the obstacles in us to the power that is in us if the sunlight is in us we got a lot of clouds in us too and the clouds prevent us from connecting to the light and steps four through nine dissipate diminish and finally eliminate those clouds so the sunlight can shine in us to us and eventually through us it's a wonderful organic process and it's a great image being convinced we are at step three which is that we decided to turn our will and our life over to god as we understood god here's the question just what do we mean and what do we do the questions that i indicated at the beginning of my discussion tonight he's going to launch us now into the heart of step three now by bill's structure he takes us into self-will run riot which we've already looked at pages 60 to 62 as the heart of unmanageability so you're welcome to take another look at that in the light of step three and remember your experience in the light of step one but next week we're going to pick it up where we leave off here but beginning on page 62 because bill answers the question what do we mean that first question of the two questions there on page 60 he answers it in the next paragraph the first requirement is that we be convinced that any life run on self-will can hardly be a success that's what we mean self-willed doesn't work well then what do we do and on page 62 and 63 he answers that question this is the how and the why of it and we'll pick it up there next week so i'd like to begin our discussion tonight i got stuck at a sentence in bill's story and is the sentence about that god did for him what he couldn't do for himself all right or in this and how are you stuck huh i thought is that possible for me do i believe that that god will do for me what i can't do for me all right yeah i thought that it wouldn't be possible for me okay yeah and i noticed in my in my prayers also i i pray a lot but to be when i'm honest i don't think that it will help Okay. But you pray anyway? Yeah, the whole time. But I don't believe in it really. All right, but you do it anyway. I do it any way. And I had some proof that it helped. but i found when i when when we had this question what i wrote about god and how do i behave i found i don't be i don' t behave in the way that i believe it makes a difference to be with god and to live in his presence hmm i don't behave after that well and and yet you said that you do actually that you pray despite your lack of belief or your lack of any sense that it's about reality but you do it anyway yeah yeah i do it anyway yeah and so really i mean that's what bill is saying see it doesn't matter what you think and it doesn t matter how you feel bill is saying it does matter what you do do. And so what's your experience with the step two process at this point? Where are you in the decision process? In the decision to be willing? Well, no, is that was that a question or a comment? was a question because I thought about am i willing the question to yourself is it a question for me or is it a to yourself because I think it's a question to yourself yes it is so you're not stuck you're in play and you have a very vital conscious question right now that's all you're not stuck you just haven't answered the question but I thought I am willing that when I really tried to to be a really honest I found it's a it's I'm not completely willing well let's examine that uh-huh you said you are in fact praying and doing the assignments and taking the actions yeah what what is your image of complete willingness that i'm really ready ready to to my to my decision to i'm really ready to believe in god i don't whether i'm really ready to believe in god all right so again i'll ask a different question you didn't answer my last question i'm going to ask this question so what would really believing in god look like for you it would change my life in what way that i would trust god more than me what would trust look like that I believe that his will for me is functioning better than mine for me all right you're just you're not really answering my question you're you're sort of using synonyms for what you've already said so let's try it again what would it look like if you really did believe i wouldn't try to manage my life myself i would trust that god knows better than me because my experience is that i can't manage my life really to have a good a life as i uh feel it's good it's a good life in my view yeah but in relationship to step two and the assignments what would belief and trust look like for you believe i'm spending this time with you and i hope everybody is embracing that this is in fact the model of coming to believe you're in process of reflecting on it i'm asking you to get more concrete in your questions and also in what your vision is of what that would look like if it in fact was your reality and everybody can benefit from this line of questioning that's why i'm spending the time with it it's it's at the bullseye of step two i believe and you've already answered it but you don't know that you've answered it to believe in god means that i i know that i know ah there you go yeah that i knew with certitude sorry honey that's not the definition of faith You see, you have a misperception of your expectation. That's why I'm spending the time in asking you and everybody else to ask themselves this question. What will it look like? What are the results? If I really do believe, if I really do embrace step two, what's it going to look like Oh, I'm going to have certitude and I'm gonna have a strong feeling. Yeah, no, not at all. Now you might, you might. but that's the essence of step two the essence of step 2 is this empty decision and then you've answered the question you say you do the prayer anyway you do assignments anyway you show up for the weekly meetings anyway and that's my definition of trust and apparently it's yours although you've not made the connection how do you mean that job you're behaving yeah you're behavior you've made a decision but it hasn't got any concreteness for you but you're operating as if it's true ah ah it doesn't get any better than that actually yeah that's it that's a problem no it's not it's the solution it's it's the reality occasionally you and or anybody else might have some sense of certitude or you might have some sense of feeling and that'll come and go it's very sick very cyclical and it's just not necessary ah yeah for me it it broke the code for step 11. this very conversation and the written the conclusion that i came to it gave me such a sense of relief for my meditation Because it doesn't matter what I think, and it doesn t matter what I feel. It does matter that I show up. That's it. Yeah. Okay. Okay. And what helped me help was when you say that it's changing, that it sometimes there and sometimes not because I had moments when I felt in connection total, and I felt yes now i'm i'm there but it's um vanished um yeah yeah but it is temporary no i'm assuming that you experience that periodically sickly yeah yeah there you go yeah that's the journey ah and you think it will increase we'll see huh hopefully yeah we'll yeah we'lI see I wonder what came to believe means that it's a process that's it that it is a process that's right thank you for really being present to this conversation it was helpful i believe to you but it was really helpful to everybody else yeah yep thanks no no thank you that was that was marvelous thank you very much i found it interesting that when um bill was talking in step two in we agnostics he used the words that what's important are honesty humility and and honestly willingness honesty openness and willingness honesty um humility and willingness and then you know in the program you know the big how honesty openness and willingness and i thought oh isn't that interesting because he says honesty humility and willingness. And that really um that struck me and I really it really uh because I know for me in working step two how really helped me a lot but I really liked the hhw version more But then when I went to the 12 and 12 in Red Step 2, he does say the honesty, open-mindedness, and willingness version. So I just thought that was interesting. So I wanted to share that. And then I have been bewitched, if you will, because that's how it's felt my whole recovery with this punishing God thing that even though I don't I mean the exercise of what do you really believe even though intellectually I know that's not true emotionally I would always end up coming back to that and I'm into what I always end up that part of me would have this fear of being punished and I finally in and going through the steps in one of my other programs, I really examined that. And again, you know, you take a look again, what do you really believe and all that? And so finally, I'm so sick of this, you know like I don't have the power to not believe it is what I really came to. I cannot change the fact that my heart keeps engaging with this punishing parent. And I don't need to tell you the history, but it's real why I would because that's what I experienced my whole childhood of my two authority figures. And and so finally, I decided, you know what? If I have no power, I need help from the power that I do know is there. And I did a sixth and seventh step on it and it's gone. and and i so that when i did the exercise this time and that wasn't that long ago that was i want to say six to eight months ago so when i didn't experience this time and i said what do i really believe that punitive god thing isn't happening it just isn't and so what was it replaced by love and compassion and grace most more than anything grace i feel like i'm going to cry because that is something that i've never known and i have to be real with you is that and maybe it's because of the people i've picked um because i'm used to being punished so let me pick another person that will punish me again but um i haven't seen it modeled a lot in the program in terms of learning that um i mean i have in a way but it's mostly been my experience and it was my experience in working the 12 steps that i realized the promise you know got it done for me what i couldn't do for myself but to engage on a daily basis with this higher power um it is now a grace compassion experience yeah yeah really softened it up wonderful yeah and that's just go ahead no it's been huge and i you know of course i screw up day in and day out and now i don't feel as afraid to screw up i don'T feel you know like when i'm doing my 10th step i DON'T feel like well i'm gonna get whacked for this one you know or you know like I have to go well I did this one again you know it's like of course I did this one is what I know to be real but and the other consequence the natural consequence that's happening too is that I feel that I get to grow up more because being punished when you're in that cycle you don't really have to experience the reality of your behavior because I'm getting punished and I'm so focused on the punishment that i don't deal with my circumstance you know and and so now i'm i'm dealing with the reality of the natural consequences of my behavior and it's like oh i didn't like that and so i think i want to change that because it affected this person or me or just the situation and i want to do it differently because i didn't like the outcome there oh what a gift of consciousness that is see dr berger and i do a lot of seminars and events on emotional sobriety and that's the whole point of it is to become conscious enough where we self-regulate and and he has a great phrase we place the center of our gravity deep inside ourselves okay we are no longer puppet strings attached to circumstances and outside events we cut all the strings to circumstances in outside people and events and we keep our center of gravity deep down inside ourselves and we manage we self-regulate Oh, okay. Well, that's awesome. That's beautiful. Yeah. Very good image. Go ahead. Oh no, I was just going to say, I'm sorry. The last thing I was going to Say is that I found out that Gandhi quoted me because that quote by, I mean, I realized the exact same thing in all of this punitive parent thing. i thought because i have grown and so my concept has got his god has grown and then i opened my big book and i'm like i found that exact note that you had told us and i had it written down i'm oh gandhi quoted me and um but that that's what i have experienced is that as i have grown and changed my concept and i just gave you a whole example of that yeah um so um i really get what he was talking about yeah so yeah so i you know it's interesting uh because i'm sponsoring um somebody who's going through step two who's had a lot of damage in their childhood and i i have found step two to be so poignant um i you know when i first went through it i just kind of like okay i don't really believe let me just act as if and go on you know and that was really appropriate at the time absolutely because the the the promise came true god did for me what i and that's where my that's when i realized oh i really do have a faith you know and and it built on from there but this in the last two times i've done the steps step too has been poignant for me yeah um and i i don't know why but maybe you do but i just yeah i know you know i don t either it's that dimmer switch concept that as we stay gently pressed up against it there's more light and then more light at some point there's sufficient light to make a difference yeah yeah okay yeah well yeah so thank you again step two i decided i need my higher power to be like uh i call it madominatrix because i really need a caring loving kind of like creator parent figure mother figure um i have this beautiful madonna figurine but i need really the structure power structure to do the things i came into this workshop really wanting to develop a consistent prayer and meditation practice and that's what i feel like i'm most powerless over i'm like i know what i need to do to connect with god but i'm powerless over the willingness to do the footwork yeah that's just not true okay tell me that's just not the one thing you have power over is willingness or unwillingness okay all right now you might not have power over the action to pursue the willingness but you you have the power to be willing or not willing but but pushing it back a little bit further you have to figure out what is the benefit or the value proposition why would you want to be willing why would you want take any action because i like how i feel when i'm in the flow like before i went on my trip i was feeling pretty in the flow i'm doing tons of meetings and this workshop and i'm putting about five or six hours a week into this workshop um and i'm doing more meditation and prayer more consistently than i have before then i went on the 17 day trip and stopped pretty much all of it except for prayer and talking to my sponsor a few times you know and i can see how i went down the shitter completely right right yeah oh it wasn't a strong enough value or benefit to you that you would continue it and therefore you see that that's why that dimmer switch metaphor is so powerful if i stay leaning leaning i don't mean you know with any arm wrestling i meant just leaning gently into it it will it will not go backwards it will at least go forward just a little bit but it won't go backwards but if in fact i let off it'll go backwards automatically because that's how it's wired right so what you did was just like oh this is really good but now i need to do something else right yeah yeah well i see it very clearly um the difference in the quality of my life and feeling so now you're back how long are you back i've been back a week and how are you doing with the leaning into the dimmer switch better definitely much better is your life getting a little bit do you feel a little but better that you're in in a good direction yes definitely all right so what is now tell me tell me though about see now we're talking right now we've been talking about you and your will and your willingness and your actions but what about god what role does god have in any of this i think god is you know god is there when i you know draw when i make connection i feel like god is an effect of the searching like if i search if i spend time maybe maybe that's just not true okay maybe the god is there at all times but without your attempt at connecting then in fact it's not translated into action but the god of my understanding as bill says right it is is but is everything if god is everything god is always totally 100 present i am afraid that i i i'm afraid that the one thing i can't handle is my lyme disease symptoms get really really wait you see how you're not answering my question why do you every time i talk to you about god you talk about yourself well maybe god well god is inside all of us i i mean no don't mouth don't mouth words to me don't give me formula don't quote me the book that's not what i'm asking get very real with me what do you believe about god I guess I'm afraid I don't know I mean I I don' t know what to say that thank you I believe that I don''t know what I believe that's your truth when I'm feeling good I believe in God God. When I'm taking action toward God, I feel God's there. But if I'm not feeling good or if I am not taking action then God is irrelevant. Well, I believe God is there. I'm just choosing not to access God. Okay, that might be true too. I don't think it is but it might be. Um, I, I would like to normally we do things in our best interest. So that's the conscious motivator. What is in your best interest? God is not very relevant or in your presence because you've not made a decision that it's so. I don't know that. i'm just i'm exploring it with you because you very uh have moments of being very disconnected yeah i think that it i think there's a thing that i've struggled with for years i've told you before i haven't used alcohol since 94 but i have chronic lyme disease and on and off over the years i've gone on and off with medication and i've had periods of like where it talks about some people have grave emotional and mental disorders sometimes i wonder if my physical disorder doesn't keep me at times from being able to be unblocked because at different times i've chosen to use pain medication to function well it may be true and then it may just smoke screen in a story to cover up you not being consistent right no i know i'm not consistent but you're cutting yourself an awful lot of slack don't you know i have lyme's disease and and that gets in my way and and that's just a crock okay yeah yeah all right yeah so stay present to this stay focused on this do the best you can in prayer meditation on a daily basis and with the assignments and see what happens okay i am practicing as well as i can i'm meditating i'm reading the book um praying when i remember to other than the serenity prayer and third-step prayer, which I automatically say. What about – why do you pray? To ask for help. From? Myself, you know. Okay, so you're praying to yourself? Well, I guess I am. okay how i think of it i'm i'm okay with that by the way yeah but dr berger who is my colleague in emotional sobriety he's a 49 years sober but he's also a clinical psychologist phd clinical psychologist he talks about in this context the best in me deals with the worst in me he just talks about my true self and my higher self so I'm I'm fine with your having this relationship with your higher self with your better self with you your true self that's good I like it yeah thank you well I mean I'm just supporting you but also using you as a moment of teaching for everybody else to broaden and be very inclusive in the in this um in in our vocabulary as our search for this power that we're looking for go ahead I'm sorry um I wish I could personalize the power a little more um I know I know it's there it's everywhere it always has been and always will be and doesn't need my two cents on how it should be So did you do the assignments for step two? Yes. Oh, well, I never assumed. And what was your conclusion at the end of that assignment in terms of the attributes and qualities God needs to be for you? That was a difficult one. And I don't think it was, well, the attributes were caring, loving, kind, funny. Always there. um i think kind's a big part a big thing for me because i get really really down on myself for not doing things the way i should be and actually when i ask for help what i'm asking for is that I see things more clearly or clearly at all, you know, and that can be really tangible parts of my day. It can also be how I think and feel about other people and respond to the world around me. I need help with it. You know, I still struggle with the unmanageability, not struggle so much. You've helped a lot with the second part of the first step. I was aware of the bedevilments before I heard you and I thought, oh, isn't that nice? But I had no connection, none. And now it's like, oh wow, that's what that's really about. It's me. It's me. I think I need probably more willingness, more focus would certainly help. I've always needed more focus. What you were saying was so wonderful and broad and inclusive. Why did you now take a little negative turn where you're not doing it you're not measuring up to your own standards what was what happened just now I looked away from the screen and I looked around my apartment which is a mess and that was like if you were really getting this you would have done more in your apartment you'd be neater than you are right now yeah yeah you hear a lot of a lot of reprimanding parental voices don't you yeah so it's your challenge here to begin reframing these voices because what you were saying before you turned negative was very positive about a power other than yourself and sort of your experiences with aspects of the assignment but then you you went sour so it's probably a habit that you have and i'm just bringing it to your attention because it's not serving you well and i am saying you have the power you have the power to reframe it as soon as you begin talking or thinking or feeling in any ways negative reframe it into something positive and i'm not talking about trickery i'm not talking abut new age subtleties no i'm just talking about you're responsible for your life and your attitude yeah yes yes and so focus on those positive attributes of a power other than yourself and pray in that set aside attitude for the incorporation of those positive attitudes in yourself oh okay yeah yeah yeah many people have said that we when we begin to think about or project excuse me or or construct our concept of god and many people talked about it earlier and on other calls it's really a projection of who they want to be and that's why when you started up by saying i talk to myself i'm asking help for myself i think i i totally reinforced that i hope for you yeah i think it's a good idea okay all right yeah thank you thank you for sharing it it gave us a new avenue of exploration so i really appreciate that thank you i've been doing good i feel like my attitude is improving i feel um you know i'm kind of grasping more this thing with god which has always been a big challenge for me uh trusting and and things like that who works um and um in my background i'm not saying this is an excuse but um there's a lot of trauma and i get stuck um hurt from the past comes up and it throws me big time in like relationships with my family sure i've had lots of therapy um and uh you were saying I was you know you were talking about step three and being in alignment with reality pray for guidance talk to somebody make a decision to accept and adjust to reality my emotions you said when you're suffering I am doing something what I couldn't write as fast as you were talking um let me just uh restart that when you're suffering you're out of alignment with reality meaning you're at cross purposes with reality it says what if the reality is you know it's a lot of old wounding um coming up in relationships today how do you deal with it what are you talking about what are you talking about old woundings if you're disturbed if you are disturbed there's something wrong with you so what's your disturbance well um hurt oh yeah okay so you're hurt you're you're hurting you're hurt and you feel rejected at the present moment by certain people that and and what if wait what if it's true that they in fact have rejected you so what that's just what they do why no no no why are you hurt well um it's it hits on my old wounds and not being i'm going to call is it's your problem put your big girl pants on now how long ago did these offenses take place many years yeah why don't you let no no no i'm not going to let you swim in the swamp why don t you let these go see now all of this is preparing you for and it's it's no it's very organic that you're asking these questions and that's why we're approaching step four and step four is like a four to five month process as we go down inventory to try to develop an understanding of the nature of these hurts and betrayals and uh sources of fear and anger in us but the the problem is not your past the problem is not you circumstances the problem Is not the people in your life the problem is your reaction currently to all of that that's the problem so how do I change my reaction I that's right you know i've been working with god you know and um well now you're no no the answer is very simple the answer is very simply you do an inventory and you do the fifth and sixth and seventh step and on the other side of it you will at least have some more information and probably a whole lot more transformation meaning all of this will be minimized in a way that you'll be able to see it and also to manage it and also to have hope that you will be doing better in managing it down in the near future. It won't happen by next week but it will happen by the end of this process. I've seen improvements, you know, but um if you if you have improvements already that's wonderful but we're not even really addressing the primary issues which we will do in steps four through nine yeah i just get thrown big time when it comes up again yeah i understand yeah do you have a sponsor yes yes i do all right do you talk to your sponsor Yes, I do. All right, great. Then show up here, do the work progressively, pray for progress yourself, and then talk to your sponsor about any sort of concerns that you have as you're navigating this process. You're definitely on the right track, and you're becoming very conscious of these things, and you're asking really good questions, but you're not able to actually absorb the answer and you don't have the tools yet to dismantle all of this story that you have about your past. Your story is true. It all did happen. All right? But your story now is irrelevant. event. Yeah, I you know, like I said, I feel like sometimes I do well with it and then and then I get thrown big time. No, no, I understand that. That's welcome to it. And I say it regularly. You might all get tired of me saying that. Welcome to the human race. That's exactly right. And in step 10, it says when we're disturbed, meaning that we're going get disturbed on a daily basis now at one time we're disturbed at the larger level but over time we get very like rather than 500 pound tuna we're we're disturbed by mosquitoes it's all relative yeah i just hate getting knocked down well i understand that and it sounds to me like you got enough energy to get back up yep that's how we learn to walk isn't it the little tall watch them in the park the the one and two-year-old toddlers are always falling down and they're always getting up and the three and four-year olds very seldom fall down yeah it hurts like hell though oh well oh well yep then you'll learn not to fall so frequently because you'll learn tools is to maintain your balance and that's emotional sobriety on the other side of nine that's emotional sobrietty self-regulation and balance and if you have any real desire to hear more about that I did a in September I believe it was I did a three hour session on step 10 and emotional uh uh sobriety all right yeah i've been using your um format for 10 and 11 and i feel like i have grown tremendously you know well you're really clear no you're really clear and you got this wonderful energy you're asking really good questions so just it's about oh i guess i'm going to have to be a little bit more patient than i want to be when you asked her the question what decision did you make about god yeah i thought we just had to make a decision god either is or he isn't so my decision was he is yeah so how do i then follow on to work out what sort of relationship do i want but what was the wait what wasthe final question in step two That was a preliminary question in response to page 53. But what was the final question in response to the end of our discussion after Bill's story? What is your, go ahead. What qualities was it and attributes? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Your concept. What is that for you? Well, to sum it up as opposed to reading whole list it's got for me uh god what do i need god i need god to have sufficient power to be present and to be a teacher i wrote here so maybe teacher nice yeah and and a healer to heal me there guide me um so that sort of yeah yeah no teacher and healer wonderful concepts yeah guidance and healing wonderful yeah yeah all right so what relationship would that signify would that connote for you i thought for me two things came up teacher and hear us i thought teacher god could be the teacher i could be the student pupil sure disciple sure yeah yeah yeah right and if it was a healer would i be healed no what would i do i don't know maybe something to do with the spiritual malady okay do you have any brokenness that needs to be fixed oh yes that wasn't a trick question right yeah yeah yeah doctor please bring the splints okay so so what would be one word the opposite of here because so you got teachers Oh, that's your question. That's your question. Oh, okay, so I have to reflect on it, right? There's no right answer here. There's just your answer. Yeah, this is the gift of this process. See, don't look at me for an answer or the book or the other people for the correct answer. No. What's your answer? What's your deepest soul and heart yearning? for our relationship from me the word that comes up is in a contentment I just want peace stay with it see what you just did and I heard it in the tone of the word not the word itself just the way you expressed it here all right that you reached down deep inside yourself for that day with that and allow it maybe maybe that's not the right word or phrase or feeling but you're that's that's the path yeah i think i'm trying to choose the right wood because i thought oh it doesn't sit right no of course no no no you need the right key to open the lock right yeah of course wrong wrong there's no key okay so i can just balance between I can balance between teacher and healer. It doesn't have to be one, does it? No, I love the concept. It's a coin. It's okay. It's like a coin having two sides. Great, great. Because perfect, that's probably been my struggle, wanting to have the perfect word. Okay, good. Thank you. Great conversation for everybody. Thank you, that was wonderful. Thank you! yeah the phrase i wrote down when you said and yet we know there's more light and i've certainly received a lot of so many many gifts um several rounds through the steps and um i think what i might want to check in with you about is just uh as you were discussing how it works and reading that initially, I was intrigued with just how that little anxiety came up again around rigorous honesty. And uh, I think I'd like to find just even more peace around that knowing kind of just give myself or i guess i want to ask about it more just i've always had this sense like i haven't been honest enough and i think it has you know there's always more i can see and i always every time i've gone around i said god show me i'm willing to see what you want to reveal to me but i sometimes have a feeling of kind of it feels more like the i'm not enough thing like that game is at play here a little bit because i think i've been as honest as i've how to be and i've had good sponsors to to help help me and guide me and poke me and question and uh i've gotten a feeling these last several weeks of just maybe part of the honesty is about um just acknowledging some parts of my uh story or my experience that have been harder to acknowledge and some of those with some really bad, I think some of the therapy abuse stuff that I went through that actually contributed a lot to my sex addiction. And as I was looking at some of The Second Stuff last week, I was surprised at how much that came up for me. And I guess what you were just talking about with Thomas Keating was helpful because I feel probably like I am able to see it more now and be willing to look at some of that and call it what it was like even I think since I it's strange because I've looked at this with and it's been a part of my step work in some way but the part of the more rigorous honesty is also just to see it like what it wasn't it was it was abuse and um because I think a part me was so invested in having a happy story uh kind of a you know always go into the triumphant story before I kind of walked through so I'm kind of feeling a little bit like part of this rigorous honesty is having to be just like with looking at not not using the end of inventory as a here's where you didn't do well, here's what it's, but the inventory is just looking at this is my life kind of taking stock of what actually happened. And so I guess I'll just leave it at that and, and see if you have any thoughts on before you leave it, though, what is it that you mean by honesty yeah it's interesting because I bet there's a part of me that feels like I have this superficial kind of thing like honesty still means just telling everything I mean kind of this reveal all as if it's that's what comes up well because you seem to really have a huge Oh, some sort of a block or, or at least reaction to the word. And then that's why I asked wonder what it means to you? Right. It's probably something for me to sit with a bit. You know, I could speak to it. When my sponsor told me in my very first efforts with him, in my first conversations that part of the program is rigorous honesty because he knew what a liar I was and how dishonest I was. He never said that, but he knew it. And he started to explain rigorous honesty. And he said, it's transparency. And I said, what's that? he said your insides and your outsides match I still didn't know what he meant but then I agreed with him because I didn't want to pursue that in a conversation any longer as a newcomer but as I did a fourth step I really got a handle on what that means that's great yeah Yeah, yeah. I think and I think I've been as transparent as I could have been so far. I wonder if that's true that that's what you think because of the way that you approached it. It seemed to me that you're one of those perfectionists that I was talking about early on, and that in fact, although that's what you want to think and believe, that there's an underneath shadow that says, yeah, but it's really I could do better if I really was better. And if I realmente was who I think I want to be, I would in fact be doing better in the honesty area. That's what I heard you say. yeah i think i think you're hitting on something really clear for me there yeah um i i get all tangled up i and i want to kind of feel like almost unnecessarily because there's a part of me that really gets i'm just simplifying everything i think my life is simplifying my understanding connection with god i loved your question of you know what do you yearn for in a relationship because yeah i just i answered that simply i felt like i yearned to be known and to be seen you heard and i i also long for that from me i want to see and hear and know i i'm very interested in this the god of truth and reality that you're speaking of so frequently i'm really interested in that i wasn't raised with that i was raised with a story like we all were i guess but i'm i crave that i yearn for that um and and i think with my honesty stuff i'm just noticing as you're speaking here tonight too that there was so much um kind of the practice of hiding in dishonesty especially around gays it was such a dark whole sin right and and I think it's just you know I'm just acknowledging to part of the honesty to say this healing is just taking it's time um and i'm i'm patient and i've received so much uh so much but i i still am so humbly in need of that care you know you had us look up the definitions and there were several definitions but the one that jumped off the page was just painstaking or watchful attention And, you know, I desire that. I need it. I am grateful that that's what that care can mean. And when I feel that care, and that's usually where I've leaned, it's where my dimmer switch has been most. I lean it on fast. I see the need for care, and I lean into it. Then I start to feel safe again, like, yeah, I don't need to be afraid of this word, honesty. um i can and as you already said at the beginning i'm on this rocket ship you know i'm listening paying attention and this rocket chip is going to take me through another step four here with you yeah yeah no it will now not without an awful lot of our hands on the instruments and making decisions about guiding the rocket but the rocket is we're the steps are now working us good yeah this is helpful um i appreciate just being willing to letting me jabber here a bit because it's um i've been really deliberate here of just wanting to have that be part of my honesty too he's just keeping it real and not coming up with a summary statement for myself before i have one well see and and that's the truth of what we're doing here and what i'm trying to model in our conversations and that is there's not a formula here there's no right answers here there are your thoughts and there are your feelings and there's your experience and those are as valid as anybody else's now they can perhaps be more helpful or more healthy as we unpack and move forward but yeah it's it's not about right words and right formulas it's about healthy thinking and experience that's the you'll hear me stress it throughout our journey is the the experience made the difference as i said and and i i'm sure most of you heard me say it the man said to me at four years of sobriety you got a lot of information herb but you don't have any transformation and the difference was i hadn't applied it i hadn t connected it i had n t had an experience with it so all i could do is jabber jabber yeah i identify it's the integration that she's being there's a there's an embodiment that's happening now that means that you're also digging down underneath and there's a little bit of a sewer flow so it could be dark and when we get into the fourth step it overflows so that's what we're doing here is preparing the really the connection to in relationship with power so that we can go navigate the sewer yeah amen well i'm so grateful that we're in the third step now too because it's the the strength and that action that you speak of has been so meaningful in my life just the uh the power of that decision and you know for me i have to i don't have to I feel called to you know when i slip back into forgetting or fear keep making that decision hourly daily you know reconnect with that which i've identified as as the power that i that's it that's that's as good as we get yeah thank you very much here's where i am in my journey through my meditations um you know i'm a little stuck on on step three with um believing that god is going to care for me yeah all of the time through thick and thin whatever yeah and i've just been met taking it to meditation every day and it's it's come to me that it's it's a very immature way or um infantile way of thinking of it and then it's come to be that that's really how i was raised with kind of a a guilt and shame environment you know anything was wrong boom there was consequence and you know any misstep you know there was a distance when I had a break with my food when I you know hurt someone that I just wasn't in his graces or in his boring world and so I took it to my prayer and I'm coming around with it it's still hard to let it all go but it's I feel like I have moved in that in that I've turned a little bit in a in a more mature direction and if i mistake make mistakes or if i do this or that so be it i pick up and go on and i i was in where i live i was in a um an fa group and you know you were you were disconnected from a sponsor when you when you had a slip right and it just reinforced that and i yes stepped away from that because i i just couldn't do it i couldn't handle that kind of uh maybe that's making excuses but it just no it's not it's it's no it it's submitting to a very unhealthy culture of shaming and guilty well it's it just was and you know you're back again and then i thought the heck with this i you know so yeah since i've moved i have not had lengthy um abstinence but i'm working on it yeah and i need to go forward and it feels better to have some of that understanding now from doing the study and doing the meditating it just it's beautiful how it comes to you this understanding when you're thinking and or not thinking but just being with you know God it's been it's been very helpful and i feel freer i feel lighter um so that's where i am all right thank you very much and it's the fidelity to the gentle action fidelity meaning that we're as consistent as we can be knowing that we can't be that consistent as we want to be but taking the actions probably not as well as we think we should knowing that that's as good as we get but also knowing that We could probably do better but we can t really do better and and kind of like living in that place of progress not perfection that Bill talked about that I read about today right yeah yeah next only gentleness works with me it doesn't work rim and fire brimstone and fire it does not work for me it just it actually really doesn't work for anybody now it has its moments of control from the outside but it never becomes self-regulating right right and that's the whole point of becoming fully human and fully alive is that we take full responsibility and we are who we are no matter who's watching right yeah and maybe you know then i hope to move to a a greater understanding or step towards self-love because you never love yourself gently and fully when you're like the task master. Don't just, I don't anyway. I should only for myself. Right. Right, right. Yeah. Thanks everybody. Very wonderful conversation. As I mentioned earlier, very vulnerable and very courageous. I so enjoy it. Thank you for all of your efforts and your honesty. Please join me in the serenity prayer. God, grant me the serENITY to accept the things I cannot change. Courage to change the things that I can. And wisdom to know the difference. Thanks everybody. Have a good week.